RRECS: Boxholders

C$$

Well-known member
The next section in our tour of the study results comparison is boxholders.

This one is fairly straight forward: Lose a little time on boxholder letters, gain a little time on boxholder flats.

You'll need to make sure your boxholders are categorized correctly. Under RRECS boxholder flat time is more than 2X boxholder letter time.

It also lists these as casing times. Presumably if you take boxholders to the street raw, you should still get the time.

You will need:
1) avg daily boxholder flats
2) avg daily boxholder letters

The program is here. Change the numbers to your numbers and press the "Run" button at the top. Here is an example:

Code:
const BOXHOLDER_FLATS = 300
const BOXHOLDER_LETTERS = 300

...

 Your previous boxholder time was 24.00 minutes per week

Your new boxholder time is 28.47 minutes per week

 You will gain 4.47 minutes per week

TLDR: This program will calculate your boxholder time under RRECS
 

DB.Cooper

Well-known member
I've noticed we're getting more "Boxholder" letter sized sets nowadays... also more that are addressed, and they're throwing many of them in DPS as well... coincidence or is there a method to this madness??? :unsure:
 

DB.Cooper

Well-known member
Actually, if the mail piece has an address on it then it is either a letter or a flat.
Are those rules the same under RRECS??? I'm talking about the "Postal Customer" or "Current Occupant", etc... but they're full coverage with addresses... sometimes they come in a brick of route order, sometimes they're throwing them in DPS.... :unsure:

Seems a lot is coming addressed now.... getting a bit confusing when we now have boxholder "flats" and "letters".... and then just flats and letters... and then just boxholders (but designated letters or flats)... DOH!?!? So is the address still the discriminator???
 

neciat

Well-known member
DB I'd have to look but from what I have seen under the RRECS system, only the time standards have changed and/ or new ones added. As far as I can tell, the definition(s) such as 6 1/8 or shorter is a letter, etc. have not been changed. Parcels are still parcels by definition but time standards for "in the box" and "at the door" are different. Kinda like the ADVO/REDPLUM cards that have an address but no name ; they are considered raw letters IF they do not come in DPS and the ADVO with NO address is the boxholder. I know we all refer to that total area/route coverage stuff as "boxholders" but the address does make the difference.
 

DB.Cooper

Well-known member
This serms like an easy and maybe likely area for abuse (theft) under RRECS.... I wonder who will be making the decisions on what these designations are when entered in to RRECS... I'm sure the NRLCA will be keeping a close eye on this.... :rolleyes:
 

C$$

Well-known member
Yes, I believe the address is what makes the difference. Here is my understanding:

Letters:

1a) letter, addressed, in a full route bundle:
WSS (walking sequence saturation) letter 0.0364 to case plus 0.0116 to verify address at box
0.048 per piece

2a) letter in DPS:
0.0116 per piece to verify address at box

3a) letter size boxholder (no address)
0.0303 per piece to case

Flats:

1b) flat, addressed, bundled (not necessarily full route coverage)
0.0741 to case plus 0.0142 to verify address
0.0883 per piece

2a) flat in FSS:
POV --> 0.0708 to case
LLV --> nil to case (not an option?)
0.0142 to verify address
0.085 for POV
0.0142 for LLV
(but this will also affect number of bundles and therefore box time)

3b) flat size boxholder (no address)
0.0646 per piece to case


In summary, from a time per piece perspective:
address in a separate bundle: BEST
boxholder, no address: GOOD
in FSS: BAD
in DPS: TERRIBLE
 

btdtret

Well-known member
DB.Cooper et al -- "This seems like an easy and maybe likely area for abuse (theft) under RRECS.... I wonder who will be making the decisions on what these designations are when entered in to RRECS... I'm sure the NRLCA will be keeping a close eye on this."

-- Well, if anything like previous "annecdotal" count evidence presented to the NRLCA, it will be with a "closed" eye.
 

neciat

Well-known member
DB That would explain why you are seeing more and more letter size WSS in your DPS. I just now saw where you put boxholder in quotes. Meaning that they really were not boxholders but you were just using the term. Anyhow, the padding of the numbers has already begun if they are running that stuff in your DPS to mitigate THEIR damage. Some of the immediate concerns I have with this are : sometimes those letter size are marriage mail and you have to deliver the card with the accompanying mail piece ( advo and money pages ) and what do you do when you are missing some of one or the other ? Another concern, which I touched on on another post, is that the PO gives the mailer a break in price to have mail put in ECRWSS. So, why does the PO pay a clerk(s) to bust bundles to put it in order AGAIN ? That's where we lose money. I know the plants like to do it to run their numbers up and justify running the machines but it is awful costly.
 

btdtret

Well-known member
neciat -- "Another concern, which I touched on on another post, is that the PO gives the mailer a break in price to have mail put in ECRWSS. So, why does the PO pay a clerk(s) to bust bundles to put it in order AGAIN ? That's where we lose money. I know the plants like to do it to run their numbers up and justify running the machines but it is awful costly."

-- "Costly" doesn't mean much when it can be shown taking money from the rural side can be utilized elsewhere. So it supposedly "evens" out in the long run.

-- I suspect it is all a "numbers" game. Got to make the "numbers"!

-- Some bean counter probably determined a number needed to show efficiency in running the machines. And the USPS hierarchy believed it.

-- Have to justify the billion(s) spent on the FSS fiasco. The machines were scheduled to run so many hours to bring a return on the investment. But no one saw the end of some many magazine leaving the print version for the on-line version. So folks at the plants found a way to run up the "numbers" to keep higher-ups happy ( and off their back ). No doubt the USPS VP of "Sustainability" still has the job.
 

WestCoastRural

Active member
DB That would explain why you are seeing more and more letter size WSS in your DPS. I just now saw where you put boxholder in quotes. Meaning that they really were not boxholders but you were just using the term. Anyhow, the padding of the numbers has already begun if they are running that stuff in your DPS to mitigate THEIR damage. Some of the immediate concerns I have with this are : sometimes those letter size are marriage mail and you have to deliver the card with the accompanying mail piece ( advo and money pages ) and what do you do when you are missing some of one or the other ? Another concern, which I touched on on another post, is that the PO gives the mailer a break in price to have mail put in ECRWSS. So, why does the PO pay a clerk(s) to bust bundles to put it in order AGAIN ? That's where we lose money. I know the plants like to do it to run their numbers up and justify running the machines but it is awful costly.

It’s pretty cut and dry with advo/ marriage mail. On the bottom of the letter, it stated you must deliver with the other paid accompanying mail. So there are firm arguments can make here.

“So, why does the PO pay a clerk(s) to bust bundles to put it in order AGAIN ? That's where we lose money.” BINGO and you don’t have to be a rocket scientist.

And btdret is right. It’s a number’s game. Some bean counter was calculating how much the PO would save if they turned all bundled flats into FSS flats.
 
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