Study offices

Morty

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I met 2 people from study offices. They are also doing mapping.

They didn't seem bothered with rrecs one bit
 

Old Fart

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For what it's worth -- Our union state president indicated that for many routes even those without Amazon intensity it should add an hour to each route weekly. She seems informed, but again, not sure who's side the union is on sometimes. I nominated and sent one of our carriers to the study and mapping test last year. She said it was confusing, a pain, ridiculously data intensive, but from that perspective alone saw no major downside to us as carriers. I've seen mapping and I will be the facilitator for our offices, more class needed to be decent at it, and I don't see specific downside.

My concerns? How is management going to use what they've got to reduce hours and route sizes. Local PM's don't want reductions, but they've got to follow District and Region dictates. Almost nobody in mid and senior PO management has worked or knows much about rural carriers. All they know is city. Their adversarial relationship permeates down to our PM's and they're going to be forced into decisions that really aren't theirs. Local management hates what their bosses are telling them to do but they feel trapped also. Hope it turns out better, as I for one am proactive to try to mitigate or change anything that's grossly unfair where a case can be made to make the change. I know many of you out there are on the same page.
 

btdtret

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Old Fart et al -- "Our union state president indicated that for many routes even those without Amazon intensity it should add an hour to each route weekly."

-- Well, that "hour" may come close to making up for losing the 20-minute Stamp Stock time, some of the 30-minutes lost for having a postal-provided vehicle and the 5-minutes of Personal Time. No telling how the numerous travel-time standards will affect a route. Since "L" and "Non-L" routes go away, everyone will have a slight decrease in the initial value of curbside mailboxes and cluster box slots. And if the mailbox is not "serviced", no credit at all.

" She seems informed, but again, not sure who's side the union is on sometimes."

-- Could be she remembers Arbitrator Clarke's words: "The cost involved in the Mileage standard adjustment sought ( over one billion dollars ) is so great that this Board of Arbitration could not grant it without doing serious harm to the USPS and eventually to Rural Letter Carriers."

-- Maybe it is the NRLCA's position if they ask for too much, it will cause the USPS to go under, costing every postal craft job, not just rural carriers. They might view it as not getting too greedy. ( of course, when did the NRLCA get everything they asked for? )
 

R5

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Your union state president is wrong. RRECS will lower rural carriers pay and lower their evaluations across the nation. Get a calculator and figure it out.
The one hour increase will be for all the new scans we will have to do. Has nothing to do with what rrecs will do. But your one of the smart ones on this site because you took the time to use your calculator to do the math.
 

Skierstmoritz

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In our office we figure the only positive gains we will get from rrecs is package dismount time(buried in Amazon) and some drive time(L routes. We never go 30 mph) and actual loading time. Can't see it any other way. I hope we are wrong.
 

too many yrs left

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The one hour increase will be for all the new scans we will have to do. Has nothing to do with what rrecs will do. But your one of the smart ones on this site because you took the time to use your calculator to do the math.
And what exactly are "all the new scans we will have to do" that could possibly cause a one hour increase?
 

C$$

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In our office we figure the only positive gains we will get from rrecs is package dismount time(buried in Amazon) and some drive time(L routes. We never go 30 mph) and actual loading time. Can't see it any other way. I hope we are wrong.
You should gain on "Reload/Unload" time too (Currently fixed 18min/week). This section is rather poorly explained in the study results, so it's difficult to say how much time to expect, but it looks like it should be a gain for most.
 

btdtret

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C$$ -- Let "RuralDivation" know that airlines are waiving the cancellation fee, though he probably does know if watching the TV news lately.

-- Don't know about the actual ticket price though.
 

R5

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And what exactly are "all the new scans we will have to do" that could possibly cause a one hour increase?
There will be 6 mandatory scans everyday ( clock in , start load, stop load, begin route, end route, clock out ) as well as 15 more possible scans you could perform during the day ( wss flats, wss letters, boxholder flats, boxholder letters, begin deviation, end of deviation, that's a few )
You can find the info under engineer study, update on rural route evaluation compensation system dated 1/4/2019. Sorry I don't know how to paste it for you to see. Maybe someone could do it.
 

C$$

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...
You can find the info under engineer study, update on rural route evaluation compensation system dated 1/4/2019. Sorry I don't know how to paste it for you to see. Maybe someone could do it.
Here is the link to the posting on rural info.
And here is a link to the standup talk inside of that posting.

@Morty When you say "they didn't seem bothered with RRECS one bit." Do you mean they were convinced RRECS was going to be an overall good thing for them and their office. Or do you mean they were completely apathetic and just blindly doing what they were told?

I for one am concerned: why haven't we gotten an estimate of RRECS impact?
1) The NRLCA really has no idea how RRECS will affect routes. After all of this time, I'd have to call that negligence.
2) OR The NRLCA does have an estimate, but for some reason they are repressing the info. But why???
3) OR maybe the NRLCA and the PO just want to wait and give all of us a nice surprise raise! :)
 

MNPostman

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Here is the link to the posting on rural info.
And here is a link to the standup talk inside of that posting.

@Morty When you say "they didn't seem bothered with RRECS one bit." Do you mean they were convinced RRECS was going to be an overall good thing for them and their office. Or do you mean they were completely apathetic and just blindly doing what they were told?

I for one am concerned: why haven't we gotten an estimate of RRECS impact?
1) The NRLCA really has no idea how RRECS will affect routes. After all of this time, I'd have to call that negligence.
2) OR The NRLCA does have an estimate, but for some reason they are repressing the info. But why???
3) OR maybe the NRLCA and the PO just want to wait and give all of us a nice surprise raise! :)
I'm still convinced RRECS will never work. I got a fairly flat route, and still have blackout spots where scanner doesn't get a signal. How can they implement our salary based on GPS scanner when it's not 100% accurate. I would imagine many routes are worse then mine for blackouts.
 

C$$

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...
I got a fairly flat route, and still have blackout spots where scanner doesn't get a signal.
...
When you say "doesn't get a signal" do you mean a GPS signal or a cell signal?

Cell signal is surfaced based. There are definitely areas in the country w/o cell coverage. But that's not a big deal, just store up the data and beam it back to Mothership when the scanner comes back on the grid.

GPS is space based. It "should" work just about anywhere. Where it does have trouble is dense canopy and urban environments (tall buildings). Part of mapping is trying to mitigate GPS errors: your pay will be based on the locations set in the database. They still need GPS to "trigger" these points, but the actual pay will be based on what's in the database. But yeah, if GPS just stopped working, or say your scanner breaks in the middle of the route, what do they do with that day's data? Maybe just throw it out? I've never seen this addressed.

In general I agree with you. Lots of questions and concerns and we are left in the dark while the PO blasts ahead full steam. Helluva way to run a railroad!
 

DB.Cooper

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RRECS is such a weird kabuki dance.... they'll be able to rig the evaluations to whatever they want, and nobody will be able to question it.... it's like the scammer sitting still and backing reports.... they show up on the computer morning reports, so they must be correct.... :oops:
 

Havenowgone

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Here is the link to the posting on rural info.
And here is a link to the standup talk inside of that posting.

@Morty When you say "they didn't seem bothered with RRECS one bit." Do you mean they were convinced RRECS was going to be an overall good thing for them and their office. Or do you mean they were completely apathetic and just blindly doing what they were told?

I for one am concerned: why haven't we gotten an estimate of RRECS impact?
1) The NRLCA really has no idea how RRECS will affect routes. After all of this time, I'd have to call that negligence.
2) OR The NRLCA does have an estimate, but for some reason they are repressing the info. But why???
3) OR maybe the NRLCA and the PO just want to wait and give all of us a nice surprise raise! :)
I too am concerned about the impact of RRECS
1) I don't believe the NRLCA doesn't know how RRECS will impact rural routes. They should at least know how it will impact the study routes. We have inputted information for them since August of 2014 and they have created and verified the standards. Why aren't they telling us?
2) I was looking forward to the implementation of RRECS. There was no way that my route would have not have gained significantly if the study did what it was supposed to do....get the right times for the things we do and a more accurate reflection of the volume we delivered.
3)They told us that between 80-90% of carriers should be able to meet or beat their evals. While this sounds good, I worry about all the carriers who can beat their evals by many hours each week right now. While they may still be able to beat their evals, they may suffer a massive loss in evaluation. If what I read in many posts is true, there are carriers who can beat their evals by 2-3 hours each day. Those types of routes may lose 10 or more hours in evaluation each week
 

Morty

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@C$$ one person is heavily involved in the union, deep. They have been doing actions none of us have or are even an option on our scanner. They were under the impression that no route will lose. It pretty much mocks the city routine, so they said. Lots of scans.

Either they were towing the line and being a loyal sheep (highly possible) or the information they are privy to, leads them to believe we will be ok (plausible).

I'll be meeting with these guys over the next months. I don't know what to ask? They get to see the raw data, we don't. Sad.
 

DB.Cooper

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I too am concerned about the impact of RRECS
1) I don't believe the NRLCA doesn't know how RRECS will impact rural routes. They should at least know how it will impact the study routes. We have inputted information for them since August of 2014 and they have created and verified the standards. Why aren't they telling us?
2) I was looking forward to the implementation of RRECS. There was no way that my route would have not have gained significantly if the study did what it was supposed to do....get the right times for the things we do and a more accurate reflection of the volume we delivered.
3)They told us that between 80-90% of carriers should be able to meet or beat their evals. While this sounds good, I worry about all the carriers who can beat their evals by many hours each week right now. While they may still be able to beat their evals, they may suffer a massive loss in evaluation. If what I read in many posts is true, there are carriers who can beat their evals by 2-3 hours each day. Those types of routes may lose 10 or more hours in evaluation each week
Last time I heard a average number assigned to the "bump" ... it was like about 5 or 6 hours per week.... now multiply that by ~ 75,000 routes.... and you're talking about some real $$$$ money coming out of the wallets of rural carriers.....

Not sure how valid the "bump" numbers really are.... but if they can use it to reduce our pay.... those lost $$$ dollars will be real.... :(
 

DB.Cooper

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@C$$ one person is heavily involved in the union, deep. They have been doing actions none of us have or are even an option on our scanner. They were under the impression that no route will lose. It pretty much mocks the city routine, so they said. Lots of scans.

Either they were towing the line and being a loyal sheep (highly possible) or the information they are privy to, leads them to believe we will be ok (plausible).

I'll be meeting with these guys over the next months. I don't know what to ask? They get to see the raw data, we don't. Sad.
Maybe @C$$ is a mole or a plant by the USPS/NRLCA to get us to swallow this poison pill called RRECS.... or maybe he's just clairvoyant.... ;)
 
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