Vacant Route or Semi-Vacant Route Question

[lovehawkins2003]

I am currently in a situation where the regular carrier on the route I’m currently running has been out due to a non post office injury/surgery for over 2 years now. Well, she filed a grievance against the postmaster after she was sent the termination letter (and after the time frame to file a grievance) the union is fighting for her. Which then caused the delay in the route going up for bid. The grievance is now at step 3 and waiting to be determined by arbitration. I’ve been running the route now since 3/30 of this year. I transferred to this office 3/30 of this year in hopes of getting this position because there were no eligible subs. Well now the other sub is done with her probationary period and because she was hired at this office before me she had seniority..although I’ve been hired on altogether longer than she have. All of this really discourages me and aggravates me. Is there anything I can do, or need to know? I did just start receiving my leave and sick time. But as far as being knowledgeable about anything that can help in my situation is what I’m asking?

 

[UnknownUser]

I am currently in a situation where the regular carrier on the route I’m currently running has been out due to a non post office injury/surgery for over 2 years now. Well, she filed a grievance against the postmaster after she was sent the termination letter (and after the time frame to file a grievance) the union is fighting for her. Which then caused the delay in the route going up for bid. The grievance is now at step 3 and waiting to be determined by arbitration. I’ve been running the route now since 3/30 of this year. I transferred to this office 3/30 of this year in hopes of getting this position because there were no eligible subs. Well now the other sub is done with her probationary period and because she was hired at this office before me she had seniority..although I’ve been hired on altogether longer than she have. All of this really discourages me and aggravates me. Is there anything I can do, or need to know? I did just start receiving my leave and sick time. But as far as being knowledgeable about anything that can help in my situation is what I’m asking?

You need to contact your district union representative or assistant district representative. If you are not a paying member you still will receive representation so no worries there. When switching offices from one city to another you do lose your in office seniority and retain your hire date but you need to talk to someone who knows about how seniority is determined when bidding a route from your situation. Normally it's 1 year of continuous service to bid.
To elaborate a little more but probably what you don't want to hear. I think what could happen with a good chance is not in your favor. I think they'll say 1 year continuous service means in your office and they could post the route you are currently on. No one able to take it, unless the other RCA is at a year, it gets posted district wide and you go back to one day a week. Or the other RCA gets awarded the route and then you are their sub.

 

[EthelAnne]

Ok, a couple of things: the other RCA needs to complete one year of service in order to be eligible to bid, not just the 90 days probation. (BTW, "continuous service" just means employment isn't interrupted by resignation and being rehired--not to muddy the waters here, but there are several positions in the USPS that require employees to take a "break in service" so it's quite common. Anyway, not an issue here, since transferring to another office does not stop the clock on continuous service).

As with most questions on this forum, the answer is talk to your union rep. They'll be able to access the information needed to figure out what's happening here. This is all going to hinge on dates and times and whether or not management followed procedures in a timely manner, and what they understood about the injured carrier's return to work date and whether or not they took reasonable actions based on the information they had.

Good luck.

 

[lovehawkins2003]

Ok, a couple of things: the other RCA needs to complete one year of service in order to be eligible to bid, not just the 90 days probation. (BTW, "continuous service" just means employment isn't interrupted by resignation and being rehired--not to muddy the waters here, but there are several positions in the USPS that require employees to take a "break in service" so it's quite common. Anyway, not an issue here, since transferring to another office does not stop the clock on continuous service).

As with most questions on this forum, the answer is talk to your union rep. They'll be able to access the information needed to figure out what's happening here. This is all going to hinge on dates and times and whether or not management followed procedures in a timely manner, and what they understood about the injured carrier's return to work date and whether or not they took reasonable actions based on the information they had.

Good luck.

Thank u both for your responses! Ok so...both of u suggested contacting the union rep...(I am a member of the union too btw) but I know that our union rep is fighting for the carrier to get her job back. So wouldn’t that be a conflict?

 

[lovehawkins2003]

Ok, a couple of things: the other RCA needs to complete one year of service in order to be eligible to bid, not just the 90 days probation. (BTW, "continuous service" just means employment isn't interrupted by resignation and being rehired--not to muddy the waters here, but there are several positions in the USPS that require employees to take a "break in service" so it's quite common. Anyway, not an issue here, since transferring to another office does not stop the clock on continuous service).

As with most questions on this forum, the answer is talk to your union rep. They'll be able to access the information needed to figure out what's happening here. This is all going to hinge on dates and times and whether or not management followed procedures in a timely manner, and what they understood about the injured carrier's return to work date and whether or not they took reasonable actions based on the information they had.

Good luck.

You need to contact your district union representative or assistant district representative. If you are not a paying member you still will receive representation so no worries there. When switching offices from one city to another you do lose your in office seniority and retain your hire date but you need to talk to someone who knows about how seniority is determined when bidding a route from your situation. Normally it's 1 year of continuous service to bid.
To elaborate a little more but probably what you don't want to hear. I think what could happen with a good chance is not in your favor. I think they'll say 1 year continuous service means in your office and they could post the route you are currently on. No one able to take it, unless the other RCA is at a year, it gets posted district wide and you go back to one day a week. Or the other RCA gets awarded the route and then you are their sub.
View attachment 666

Ok so they did send the carrier the letter..and I was told she had 15 days to respond. But she didn’t respond until right after the deadline. I also heard by the ladies in the office that she didn’t get her medical release and physical completed til after the deadline for that. I also heard that the carrier was gonna just let the job go but someone convinced her to go to the union so now they’re backing her and something like she wasn’t a member of the union but had to come up with some union dues or something of that nature. And I also heard that the grievance she filed was against the postmaster and that’s how she was able to file it being after the deadline... I know this is a bunch of extra! Smh.

 

[UnknownUser]

Ok so they did send the carrier the letter..and I was told she had 15 days to respond. But she didn’t respond until right after the deadline. I also heard by the ladies in the office that she didn’t get her medical release and physical completed til after the deadline for that. I also heard that the carrier was gonna just let the job go but someone convinced her to go to the union so now they’re backing her and something like she wasn’t a member of the union but had to come up with some union dues or something of that nature. And I also heard that the grievance she filed was against the postmaster and that’s how she was able to file it being after the deadline... I know this is a bunch of extra! Smh.

Union status does not matter. They are required to follow the contract. There's a binding agreement between the USPS and NRLCA. If that carrier has been out for 2 years they need to place her on a phantom route. Your management has not followed the contract if it has been over 2 years. The union will try to get her job back but she needs to be placed on a phantom route until she's able to come back to full duty. Then she will be an excessed carrier and will have to take what she can get in your area when she's able.

I've got a coworker that recently went regular after me and they had about 5 years more time than I had. The reason I went regular before them was because they transferred from another office about 60 miles away and it took them 3 years to get a route at my office after they had transferred.

The only thing I am unsure of is in your details. From what I understand, a RCA is under probation for 90 working days or a year, whichever comes first. If that RCA has passed a year they will be above you in seniority for sure and if they were to bid properly, they would win the route bid. Otherwise it'll be posted to the district. I'm pretty certain an ADR or district rep will confirm everything I have said.

 

[UnknownUser]

Ok, a couple of things: the other RCA needs to complete one year of service in order to be eligible to bid, not just the 90 days probation. (BTW, "continuous service" just means employment isn't interrupted by resignation and being rehired--not to muddy the waters here, but there are several positions in the USPS that require employees to take a "break in service" so it's quite common. Anyway, not an issue here, since transferring to another office does not stop the clock on continuous service).

The rural craft is different from all the other crafts. You lose any seniority by transferring. The only thing an RCA will keep is their pay grade. 'Breaks in service' does not translate to the rural craft at all and any time prior will not count towards continuous service.

 

[EthelAnne]

The rural craft is different from all the other crafts. You lose any seniority by transferring. The only thing an RCA will keep is their pay grade. 'Breaks in service' does not translate to the rural craft at all and any time prior will not count towards continuous service.

I understand. Transferring loses seniority; it does not constitute a break in service or interruption of continuous service.

 

[EthelAnne]

Thank u both for your responses! Ok so...both of u suggested contacting the union rep...(I am a member of the union too btw) but I know that our union rep is fighting for the carrier to get her job back. So wouldn’t that be a conflict?

The union represents carriers under the terms of the contract. Whether or not your claim has merit--who knows? The same is true of hers--that's what the grievance process is for: to determine exactly what happened here and what should have happened under the terms of the contract. She may lose her grievance; you may lose yours. You won't know unless you file.

And regarding what "the ladies in the office are saying"--don't get your hopes up that any of that is accurate.

 

[UnknownUser]

I understand. Transferring loses seniority; it does not constitute a break in service or interruption of continuous service.

From the contract:

g. If a vacancy still exists, it shall be awarded to the
RCA applicant having one (1) year of continuous
service as an RCA and having accrued the
longest period of continuous service as an RCA in
that office, unless another RCA is deemed to be
substantially better qualified.


The real question is if the other RCA has a year of service. '1 year continuous service as an RCA in that office' unless you can prove you are substantially better qualified, you are out of luck.

 

[lovehawkins2003]

Union status does not matter. They are required to follow the contract. There's a binding agreement between the USPS and NRLCA. If that carrier has been out for 2 years they need to place her on a phantom route. Your management has not followed the contract if it has been over 2 years. The union will try to get her job back but she needs to be placed on a phantom route until she's able to come back to full duty. Then she will be an excessed carrier and will have to take what she can get in your area when she's able.

I've got a coworker that recently went regular after me and they had about 5 years more time than I had. The reason I went regular before them was because they transferred from another office about 60 miles away and it took them 3 years to get a route at my office after they had transferred.

The only thing I am unsure of is in your details. From what I understand, a RCA is under probation for 90 working days or a year, whichever comes first. If that RCA has passed a year they will be above you in seniority for sure and if they were to bid properly, they would win the route bid. Otherwise it'll be posted to the district. I'm pretty certain an ADR or district rep will confirm everything I have said.

The other RCA just completed her probationary period. She hasn’t been there a year yet but she’s worked 90 working days. Also...why would the job post to the district when I’m eligible to bid on it?

Also, why would the union push so hard to get her job back? And do u think I should contact the union steward (that is trying to help her get her job back)?

 

[UnknownUser]

The other RCA just completed her probationary period. She hasn’t been there a year yet but she’s worked 90 working days. Also...why would the job post to the district when I’m eligible to bid on it?

Also, why would the union push so hard to get her job back? And do u think I should contact the union steward (that is trying to help her get her job back)?

I don't think you are eligible to win a bid. Call someone, the ADR or DR as soon as possible. The union has to represent her, they also have to represent you. There is no conflict of interest. You need to contact them and you should have contacted them at the two year point. There's a time frame to file grievances. Just tell them you just found out that the route should have been posted. They may say you have passed the allowable time to file. Idk but if I were you I would contact someone tonight if possible to get answers.

Follow up in the thread so if anyone in a similar situation is looking for answers in the future they can read this. I see a similar post from a few months ago that you started with no resolution. Get answers from the union ASAP. Heck I could be wrong, I've been mistaken a time or two but I firmly believe the way I read the contract and also what my coworker that transferred told me, I am correct. Surprise me!

 

[gotstamps]

The other RCA just completed her probationary period. She hasn’t been there a year yet but she’s worked 90 working days. Also...why would the job post to the district when I’m eligible to bid on it?

Also, why would the union push so hard to get her job back? And do u think I should contact the union steward (that is trying to help her get her job back)?

If the job posted then the injured carrier lost their case to getting their route back. As long as a grievance is in play, mgmt is not supposed to bid a route out.
If the route went to District Bidding without Bidding Local, AND any subs in the office had 1 year or more service with the PO, then contact your Union Rep ASAP about it! They will likely need a written statement saying that mgmt did not POST the Local Bidding in office. If it was posted but not mentioned or announced, there’s been no violation.

 

[Rt2mailman]

You couldn't have passed the time to file because the route still hasn't been posted, and it is still is past 2 years. File away. If you wait another 8-9 months that other RCA will be able to bid and win.

 

[UnknownUser]

You couldn't have passed the time to file because the route still hasn't been posted, and it is still is past 2 years. File away. If you wait another 8-9 months that other RCA will be able to bid and win.

If it's even 8 or 9 months. There's not a lot of info on that RCA in this thread. They could be much closer to a year.

OP needs to contact someone asap. The other thread is from June I think. Same situation.

 

[lovehawkins2003]

If the job posted then the injured carrier lost their case to getting their route back. As long as a grievance is in play, mgmt is not supposed to bid a route out.
If the route went to District Bidding without Bidding Local, AND any subs in the office had 1 year or more service with the PO, then contact your Union Rep ASAP about it! They will likely need a written statement saying that mgmt did not POST the Local Bidding in office. If it was posted but not mentioned or announced, there’s been no violation.

The job hasn’t been posted yet, due to the grievance the injured worker has against the PM.

 

[lovehawkins2003]

If it's even 8 or 9 months. There's not a lot of info on that RCA in this thread. They could be much closer to a year.

OP needs to contact someone asap. The other thread is from June I think. Same situation.

The other RCA started in December of last year. She just recently reached her 90 working days. I believe there were maybe 2 other rcas already working at this office when she got hired on 1 of them quit and there was a situation with the other one therefore making this particular Rca the only one brand new sub at this office. I helped out at this Office a lot for extra work. Which is how I then found out about the vacant Route that was going to be Posted soon due to letter of separation that had went to the reg and no grievance had been filed yet... And due to the fact of the only sub being so new..I had a good chance at getting the route if I could get transferred over quickly before the route went up. So between the 2 PMs and myself we made it happen. So now I get transferred over and the route still hasn’t gone up. I hope that clarifies the situation better so that I can get the best advice.

 

[gotstamps]

The other RCA started in December of last year. She just recently reached her 90 working days. I believe there were maybe 2 other rcas already working at this office when she got hired on 1 of them quit and there was a situation with the other one therefore making this particular Rca the only one brand new sub at this office. I helped out at this Office a lot for extra work. Which is how I then found out about the vacant Route that was going to be Posted soon due to letter of separation that had went to the reg and no grievance had been filed yet... And due to the fact of the only sub being so new..I had a good chance at getting the route if I could get transferred over quickly before the route went up. So between the 2 PMs and myself we made it happen. So now I get transferred over and the route still hasn’t gone up. I hope that clarifies the situation better so that I can get the best advice.

So then the question is to how long have you been an RCA? When a route posts in office (Local), all Regular Carriers, PTFs, & RCAs (over 1 year) can bid. The route will first bid Local prior to going to District. If NO RCAs have over 1 year of service OR that sub miss-bids, then the residual will bid District. RCAs with less than 1 year are not eligible to bid regardless of their Probationary status.

 

[lovehawkins2003]

So then the question is to how long have you been an RCA? When a route posts in office (Local), all Regular Carriers, PTFs, & RCAs (over 1 year) can bid. The route will first bid Local prior to going to District. If NO RCAs have over 1 year of service OR that sub miss-bids, then the residual will bid District. RCAs with less than 1 year are not eligible to bid regardless of their Probationary status.

I have been an Rca since Feb of last year, so a lil over a year. So I guess now I’m just waiting for the outcome of this grievance.. Which I’ve read from other post could take a couple years right? I guess all I can do is hope and pray it’s resolved before that carrier reaches a year.

 

[gotstamps]

I have been an Rca since Feb of last year, so a lil over a year. So I guess now I’m just waiting for the outcome of this grievance.. Which I’ve read from other post could take a couple years right? I guess all I can do is hope and pray it’s resolved before that carrier reaches a year.

Not likely “years” on an issue like this. Months, maybe, since it’s pertaining to a Carrier’s livelihood.