to start a grievance about not getting vacation? I have probably 50 denied vacation requests over the last 5 years. All due to lack of subs. And Ive been told i wont get vacation until an rca is hired. except we have a vacant route in office, so its going to take two subs to get hired before I get vacation, or even a day off. Btw, i got put on a deem? list because i called off the day after labor day. I now need a doctors excuse to take a sick day. After informing me of that, pm tells me she has the day after the holiday this monday as vacation, so no one will be there to cover. I hadnt planned on taking a sick day, but it seems management gets all their days...
do i have to file a 120 day letter
- Thread starter johnwayne
- Start date
FILE!!!!!!
johnwayne -- "to start a grievance about not getting vacation? I have probably 50 denied vacation requests over the last 5 years. All due to lack of subs. And Ive been told i wont get vacation until an rca is hired. except we have a vacant route in office, so its going to take two subs to get hired before I get vacation, or even a day off. Btw, i got put on a deem? list because i called off the day after labor day. I now need a doctors excuse to take a sick day. After informing me of that, pm tells me she has the day after the holiday this Monday as vacation, so no one will be there to cover. I hadn't planned on taking a sick day, but it seems management gets all their days...".
-- What are the two route classifications in the office?
-- Filing the 120-Day notice probably won't do you any good in the short-run, but in the long-run, it creates a paper trail, something manglement does not like.
-- Get your Assistant District Representative involved ASAP.
-- Go on line and down load the ELM ( Employee Labor Management Manual ). You will want to look at Chapter 5's Section 513.39 regarding your being placed on the "Deems Desirable" list, which manglement uses to "protect the interests of the Postal Service" from personnel who abuse sick leave.
-- Did the PM provide you with WRITTEN notice that you have been placed on the Restricted Sick Leave List? If not, that is a grievance. Since things will probably get ugly, ask your PM for an 8191 ( Grievance Form ). If the PM indicates that there are no 8191s available, that too is a grievance, citing Section 142.3 of the PO-603: The USPS supplies all additional necessary equipment, supplies, and FORMS. The PO-603 should be part of your route book. No route book or no PO-603 -- more grievances!
-- Other wise Google: USPS Form 8191, moving on..
-- Section 513.391 - Reasons for Restriction
- Supervisors or installation heads who have evidence indicating that an employee is abusing sick leave privileges MAY place the employee on the restricted sick leave list. In addition, employees MAY be placed on the restricted sick leave use has been reviewed on an individual basis AND the following ACTIONS HAVE BEEN TAKEN:
a. Establishment of an absence file. ( have your ADR request the "absence file" )
b. Review of the absence file by the immediate supervisor AND higher levels of management.
c. Review of the absences during the past quarter of LWOP and sick leave by employees. ( No minimum sick leave balance is established which the employee's sick leave record is automatically considered unsatisfactory. )
d. Supervisor's discussion of absence record with the employee. ( have your ADR request any "notes" from the discussion )
e. Review of the subsequent quarterly absences. If the absence logs indicate no improvement, the supervisor is to discuss the matter with the employee to include advice that if there is no improvement during the next quarter, the employee will be placed on restricted sick leave.
-- Section 513.392 Notice and Listing
- Supervisors PROVIDE WITTEN NOTICE to employees that their name have been added to the restricted sick leave listing. The notice also explains that, until further notice, the employees must support all requests for sick leave by medical documentation or other acceptable evidence.
-- As an outsider, sure sounds as if your PM has missed a few steps. Something to discuss with your Assistant District Representative.
-- With the PM taking the Tuesday after the Monday holiday, who will be in charge of the office?
-- Good luck.
-- What are the two route classifications in the office?
-- Filing the 120-Day notice probably won't do you any good in the short-run, but in the long-run, it creates a paper trail, something manglement does not like.
-- Get your Assistant District Representative involved ASAP.
-- Go on line and down load the ELM ( Employee Labor Management Manual ). You will want to look at Chapter 5's Section 513.39 regarding your being placed on the "Deems Desirable" list, which manglement uses to "protect the interests of the Postal Service" from personnel who abuse sick leave.
-- Did the PM provide you with WRITTEN notice that you have been placed on the Restricted Sick Leave List? If not, that is a grievance. Since things will probably get ugly, ask your PM for an 8191 ( Grievance Form ). If the PM indicates that there are no 8191s available, that too is a grievance, citing Section 142.3 of the PO-603: The USPS supplies all additional necessary equipment, supplies, and FORMS. The PO-603 should be part of your route book. No route book or no PO-603 -- more grievances!
-- Other wise Google: USPS Form 8191, moving on..
-- Section 513.391 - Reasons for Restriction
- Supervisors or installation heads who have evidence indicating that an employee is abusing sick leave privileges MAY place the employee on the restricted sick leave list. In addition, employees MAY be placed on the restricted sick leave use has been reviewed on an individual basis AND the following ACTIONS HAVE BEEN TAKEN:
a. Establishment of an absence file. ( have your ADR request the "absence file" )
b. Review of the absence file by the immediate supervisor AND higher levels of management.
c. Review of the absences during the past quarter of LWOP and sick leave by employees. ( No minimum sick leave balance is established which the employee's sick leave record is automatically considered unsatisfactory. )
d. Supervisor's discussion of absence record with the employee. ( have your ADR request any "notes" from the discussion )
e. Review of the subsequent quarterly absences. If the absence logs indicate no improvement, the supervisor is to discuss the matter with the employee to include advice that if there is no improvement during the next quarter, the employee will be placed on restricted sick leave.
-- Section 513.392 Notice and Listing
- Supervisors PROVIDE WITTEN NOTICE to employees that their name have been added to the restricted sick leave listing. The notice also explains that, until further notice, the employees must support all requests for sick leave by medical documentation or other acceptable evidence.
-- As an outsider, sure sounds as if your PM has missed a few steps. Something to discuss with your Assistant District Representative.
-- With the PM taking the Tuesday after the Monday holiday, who will be in charge of the office?
-- Good luck.
Also, there is this from Article 30 of The Nat'l Agreement. This is separate and apart from the 120 day letter language.
2. The Employer shall make every effort to expeditiously
fill leave replacement vacancies when they occur.
Regular rural carriers shall have the right to require that
a leave replacement be assigned to their route.
2. The Employer shall make every effort to expeditiously
fill leave replacement vacancies when they occur.
Regular rural carriers shall have the right to require that
a leave replacement be assigned to their route.
Did you all ready fill out a 120 day letter? If not that’s the first step, fill out make copy for yourself and management. Send original to rep, wait for time to expire. Call rep and ask how they would like you to fill out the grievance.
Pretty sad that this job punishes it's employees for using the sick time that they give you.
They make you pay a doctors visit fee for a note because you are not feeling well.
What about small things like stomach issues, migraines or just not feeling good and they MAKE you see a doctor for a note?
Crazy how this is even being allowed.
They make you pay a doctors visit fee for a note because you are not feeling well.
What about small things like stomach issues, migraines or just not feeling good and they MAKE you see a doctor for a note?
Crazy how this is even being allowed.
The Carriers that don’t file their 120-day letter have more time and energy to place a vacation day every time you are in line for a three-day holiday and take yours. To fight takes more time than just fighting.
In my day it was not encouraged to file a grievance about substitutes not being hired for other routes. The attitude followed the two examples given above about demanding substitutes. Only, the request for your own is written in.
This is really a sad point of view. As has been pointed out in this case even if the substitute is won it is unlikely this will be enough to make a substitute available. The day when a substitute for practical needs belongs to the individual carrier is long gone. I expect that very few of you go that far back.
Even the day the office controls the substitute is passing. It is becoming first come, first served. This means that hiring a substitute for other routes has a huge impact on other carriers even if they already have a substitute.
May a grievance be filed for the other carriers lack of substitutes? Unless there is a ruling preventing this, I have assumed the limitations of a grievance is what impacts, in this case, the individuals, working conditions.
In my day it was not encouraged to file a grievance about substitutes not being hired for other routes. The attitude followed the two examples given above about demanding substitutes. Only, the request for your own is written in.
This is really a sad point of view. As has been pointed out in this case even if the substitute is won it is unlikely this will be enough to make a substitute available. The day when a substitute for practical needs belongs to the individual carrier is long gone. I expect that very few of you go that far back.
Even the day the office controls the substitute is passing. It is becoming first come, first served. This means that hiring a substitute for other routes has a huge impact on other carriers even if they already have a substitute.
May a grievance be filed for the other carriers lack of substitutes? Unless there is a ruling preventing this, I have assumed the limitations of a grievance is what impacts, in this case, the individuals, working conditions.
There have been instances where upon the affected carrier(s) have submitted the Doctor bill to the PO for reimbursement. Especially, in the instances you noted ( small / minor issues ) AND the employee(s) ARE NOT on restricted sick leave.
