Has anyone been told that RCA's can not fill out leave slips? Our PM will not let RCA's fill out leave slips and then threaten them if they call in.
Leave Slips
- Thread starter Cliff Clavin
- Start date
Deer Smearer
Well-known member
Rural Daily Operations Training Handbook
Page 33
RCA Requesting Non Scheduled Day(s)
A RCA may request to take leave or a non scheduled day. This should be requested on a PS
3971 as any other carrier would. The block ‘Other’ would be the correct request.
Page 33
RCA Requesting Non Scheduled Day(s)
A RCA may request to take leave or a non scheduled day. This should be requested on a PS
3971 as any other carrier would. The block ‘Other’ would be the correct request.
Cliff Clavin et al -- "Our PM will not let RCA's fill out leave slips and then threaten them if they call in."
-- Without a leave slip, a carrier could end up with a charge of being AWOL.
-- Fill out a leave slip. If the PM refuses to sign it or even look at it, make a notation on the slip. It's your assets that need to be covered.
-- Inform your Assistant District Representative of your PM's actions.
-- Without a leave slip, a carrier could end up with a charge of being AWOL.
-- Fill out a leave slip. If the PM refuses to sign it or even look at it, make a notation on the slip. It's your assets that need to be covered.
-- Inform your Assistant District Representative of your PM's actions.
Yesterday we had an RCA whose husband was having surgery, The PM would not let her fill out a leave slip to be with her husband during this surgery nor was she permitted to have the day off to be with him at the hospital. The PM told her RCA's can not fill out leave slips and that she could not have the day off because the RCA's <strong><span style="text-decoration: underline">always</span></strong> had to be on call.
The poor girl is new and was crying and very visibly upset. Our PM has created a very negative and hostile work environment. I felt so sorry for her as did the fellow workers but the PM has everyone so scared that no one wants to to confront the PM for fear of reprisal.
We don't have a Steward at our office because when this new PM took over after the previous one retired the steward quit being a steward after the the PM held her first meeting more than a year ago in which she stated "I am going to run this PO my way and if you don't like it you can contact your union". Our Rural Steward quit being a steward about two days later. This place has been a disaster ever since.
The poor girl is new and was crying and very visibly upset. Our PM has created a very negative and hostile work environment. I felt so sorry for her as did the fellow workers but the PM has everyone so scared that no one wants to to confront the PM for fear of reprisal.
We don't have a Steward at our office because when this new PM took over after the previous one retired the steward quit being a steward after the the PM held her first meeting more than a year ago in which she stated "I am going to run this PO my way and if you don't like it you can contact your union". Our Rural Steward quit being a steward about two days later. This place has been a disaster ever since.
Rt2mailman
Well-known member
First of all , you can file a grievance without having a Steward.
Secondly, any rca can trade work days with their regular, if that day is used during the same week. The process to do, and denote this is to have the rca request the day off on the leave slip, and the regular to sign in the comment section with the day they will take in exchange. This can be done without a problem for any manager because it doesn't effect the overtime list. RCA's can also use the 3971 (leave slip) anytime they wish to request leave. If a manager denies the leave and there were RCA's available, a grievance can be filed. If the 3971 is not answered in a reasonable amount of time, the leave is considered granted. If the manager changes (this can be considered falsification) the 3971, point out that the bottom right of the 3971 is written for her. Ask her if she would like the $10,000 fine, 5 years in prison, or both.
Secondly, any rca can trade work days with their regular, if that day is used during the same week. The process to do, and denote this is to have the rca request the day off on the leave slip, and the regular to sign in the comment section with the day they will take in exchange. This can be done without a problem for any manager because it doesn't effect the overtime list. RCA's can also use the 3971 (leave slip) anytime they wish to request leave. If a manager denies the leave and there were RCA's available, a grievance can be filed. If the 3971 is not answered in a reasonable amount of time, the leave is considered granted. If the manager changes (this can be considered falsification) the 3971, point out that the bottom right of the 3971 is written for her. Ask her if she would like the $10,000 fine, 5 years in prison, or both.
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Rt2mailman said </strong>
First of all , you can file a grievance without having a Steward.
Secondly, <strong>any rca can trade work days with their regular, if that day is used during the same week</strong>. The process to do, and denote this is to have the rca request the day off on the leave slip, and the regular to sign in the comment section with the day they will take in exchange. This can be done without a problem for any manager because it doesn't effect the overtime list. RCA's can also use the 3971 (leave slip) anytime they wish to request leave. If a manager denies the leave and there were RCA's available, a grievance can be filed. If the 3971 is not answered in a reasonable amount of time, the leave is considered granted. If the manager changes (this can be considered falsification) the 3971, point out that the bottom right of the 3971 is written for her. Ask her if she would like the $10,000 fine, 5 years in prison, or both. </blockquote>
I understand what you are saying and agree but the PM won't even give you one to fill out and says that they are not for RCA's.
This young girl was hired just before Christmas and hasn't been to any training and the route she was forced to work while her husband was having surgery wasn't even her primary and she hadn't even ran it before. It's just the PM making it hostile for everyone both regulars and subs.
First of all , you can file a grievance without having a Steward.
Secondly, <strong>any rca can trade work days with their regular, if that day is used during the same week</strong>. The process to do, and denote this is to have the rca request the day off on the leave slip, and the regular to sign in the comment section with the day they will take in exchange. This can be done without a problem for any manager because it doesn't effect the overtime list. RCA's can also use the 3971 (leave slip) anytime they wish to request leave. If a manager denies the leave and there were RCA's available, a grievance can be filed. If the 3971 is not answered in a reasonable amount of time, the leave is considered granted. If the manager changes (this can be considered falsification) the 3971, point out that the bottom right of the 3971 is written for her. Ask her if she would like the $10,000 fine, 5 years in prison, or both. </blockquote>
I understand what you are saying and agree but the PM won't even give you one to fill out and says that they are not for RCA's.
This young girl was hired just before Christmas and hasn't been to any training and the route she was forced to work while her husband was having surgery wasn't even her primary and she hadn't even ran it before. It's just the PM making it hostile for everyone both regulars and subs.
Shafted
Well-known member
You don't need a supervisor to give you a leave slip, and they know that. You can print one up online. There are fill able, printable ones online you can google. I had a jerk PM for a while that was so untrustworthy that I took a photograph of my leave slip next to a copy of the USA today headline with date, just in case they wanted to lie about when it was submitted. That happened a few times, until I put a stop to that game. If a situation like this ever happens again, and an RCA has a Terrific working relationship with their regular, that regular may offer to work a regular straight time day for them. It is in the contract that it is allowed. Pretty sure this tyrant PM knows this as well. Call them out on it. A bully is only a bully as long as the abused does nothing about it.
Rt2mailman
Well-known member
Every office has a steward assigned to it, even if there is no local steward there is a steward that oversees that office. You can look that up on the NRLCA website under "find my steward". You may also on that site find a blank form 3971,that you may fill out and give to you pm. It looks a little different because it has the front and back of the form on one page. Anytime a pm will not give you forms that you need you may file a grievance asking for proper supplies.
It really sounds like your pm needs a visit from an area steward or the district steward,to explain that her employees have to follow her direct orders, just as she has to follow the contract, because it was created by her superiors, and disregarding it, is disregarding their "direct order"of which she also can be disciplined, just like us. When she advances in her career enough to write, and get accepted, contracts for the USPS she then can dictate her ideas, but for now she is just a "pee-on" like us. When these types of managers receive this type of "direction" they usually take one of two avenues. 1) Pout, stay in their office alone and suck their thumbs . 2) Attempt retaliation, which, when documented and grieved, put them in deeper water than they thought they were going to put you in. These pm's can be lead to know and believe that they will receive more work and grief continuing in their poor managing and attitude than those types of actions are worth. If you could organize your office into an all out grievance "attack" for every infraction she commits, after your steward has conferred with her, she either will move to another office or change her "wicked" ways. Good luck.
It really sounds like your pm needs a visit from an area steward or the district steward,to explain that her employees have to follow her direct orders, just as she has to follow the contract, because it was created by her superiors, and disregarding it, is disregarding their "direct order"of which she also can be disciplined, just like us. When she advances in her career enough to write, and get accepted, contracts for the USPS she then can dictate her ideas, but for now she is just a "pee-on" like us. When these types of managers receive this type of "direction" they usually take one of two avenues. 1) Pout, stay in their office alone and suck their thumbs . 2) Attempt retaliation, which, when documented and grieved, put them in deeper water than they thought they were going to put you in. These pm's can be lead to know and believe that they will receive more work and grief continuing in their poor managing and attitude than those types of actions are worth. If you could organize your office into an all out grievance "attack" for every infraction she commits, after your steward has conferred with her, she either will move to another office or change her "wicked" ways. Good luck.
Deer Smearer
Well-known member
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Cliff Clavin said </strong>
I understand what you are saying and agree but the PM won't even give you one to fill out and says that they are not for RCA's.
This young girl was hired just before Christmas and hasn't been to any training and the route she was forced to work while her husband was having surgery wasn't even her primary and she hadn't even ran it before. It's just the PM making it hostile for everyone both regulars and subs. </blockquote>
I seem to recall you saying the PM was changing your times on the 4240s and 1234s.
Document that, report it to the OIG, and that will be the end of your moron PM.
I understand what you are saying and agree but the PM won't even give you one to fill out and says that they are not for RCA's.
This young girl was hired just before Christmas and hasn't been to any training and the route she was forced to work while her husband was having surgery wasn't even her primary and she hadn't even ran it before. It's just the PM making it hostile for everyone both regulars and subs. </blockquote>
I seem to recall you saying the PM was changing your times on the 4240s and 1234s.
Document that, report it to the OIG, and that will be the end of your moron PM.
Shafted
Well-known member
OMG, please please report that PM if they are changing time sheets. If everyone hasn't been paying attention to the news, Richmond VA just let 6-7 supers, and PM go for doing that and making threats in retaliation. Now is the time, and your shot to strike while the pan is hot if you want this PM outta there. I imagine the PO has a no tolerance policy "at the moment" because it hit the news so bad. We all know when the heat is over, the PO will go back to behaving like the shady employer we all know.
Cliff Clavin -- "I understand what you are saying and agree but the PM won't even give you one [3971 ] to fill out and says that they are not for RCA's.
This young girl was hired just before Christmas and hasn't been to any training and the route she was forced to work while her husband was having surgery wasn't even her primary and she hadn't even ran it before. It's just the PM making it hostile for everyone both regulars and subs."
-- Good grief! Get a hold of your Assistant District Representative or District Representative ASAP before some goes off the deep end because of your tyrannical PM!!
-- Maybe the ADR or Dr can point out to the PM that the 3971 is a Request for or Notification of ABSENCE.
-- Ask the PM to provide a reference that 3971's are not for RCA's -- if anyone dares.
"The PM told her RCA's can not fill out leave slips and that she could not have the day off because the RCA's <strong>always</strong> had to be on call."
-- While the ADR or Dr is in the office, have them explain "availability" to the PM or start 8127 payments for sitting by the phone.
No doubt your "winner" of a PM is another example of problem members of manglement that are moved from office to office to keep them employed.
Might want to suggest to the RCA that if there are other job opportunities in the community, best to take a look at them.
This young girl was hired just before Christmas and hasn't been to any training and the route she was forced to work while her husband was having surgery wasn't even her primary and she hadn't even ran it before. It's just the PM making it hostile for everyone both regulars and subs."
-- Good grief! Get a hold of your Assistant District Representative or District Representative ASAP before some goes off the deep end because of your tyrannical PM!!
-- Maybe the ADR or Dr can point out to the PM that the 3971 is a Request for or Notification of ABSENCE.
-- Ask the PM to provide a reference that 3971's are not for RCA's -- if anyone dares.
"The PM told her RCA's can not fill out leave slips and that she could not have the day off because the RCA's <strong>always</strong> had to be on call."
-- While the ADR or Dr is in the office, have them explain "availability" to the PM or start 8127 payments for sitting by the phone.
No doubt your "winner" of a PM is another example of problem members of manglement that are moved from office to office to keep them employed.
Might want to suggest to the RCA that if there are other job opportunities in the community, best to take a look at them.
gotstamps -- "WHY is she running routes without ANY training???"
-- one can thank the current contract for that happening.
-- Management's Rights - Article 3. The Employer shall have the exclusive tight: f. To take whatever actions are necessary to carry out its mission in emergency situations; i.e., an unforeseen circumstance or a combination of circumstances which calls for immediate action in a situation which is not expected to be of a recurring nature. ( we all know the definition of "emergency" usually differs between manglement and labor )
-- Page 48 of the current contract: 4. If no qualified substitutes, rural carrier associates, or rural carrier relief employees within the delivery unit are available, the Employer may designate any other leave replacement in the office prior to selecting a regular rural carrier to work in accordance with Article 8.5 .
-- one can thank the current contract for that happening.
-- Management's Rights - Article 3. The Employer shall have the exclusive tight: f. To take whatever actions are necessary to carry out its mission in emergency situations; i.e., an unforeseen circumstance or a combination of circumstances which calls for immediate action in a situation which is not expected to be of a recurring nature. ( we all know the definition of "emergency" usually differs between manglement and labor )
-- Page 48 of the current contract: 4. If no qualified substitutes, rural carrier associates, or rural carrier relief employees within the delivery unit are available, the Employer may designate any other leave replacement in the office prior to selecting a regular rural carrier to work in accordance with Article 8.5 .
gotstamps
Well-known member
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>btdtret said </strong>
gotstamps -- "WHY is she running routes without ANY training???"
-- one can thank the current contract for that happening.
-- Management's Rights - Article 3. The Employer shall have the exclusive tight: f. To take whatever actions are necessary to carry out its mission in emergency situations; i.e., an unforeseen circumstance or a combination of circumstances which calls for immediate action in a situation which is not expected to be of a recurring nature. ( we all know the definition of "emergency" usually differs between manglement and labor )
-- Page 48 of the current contract: 4. If no qualified substitutes, rural carrier associates, or rural carrier relief employees within the delivery unit are available, the Employer may designate any other leave replacement in the office prior to selecting a regular rural carrier to work in accordance with Article 8.5 . </blockquote>
They still have to be trained for postal work! Even ARCs get some sort of training! This is why on a newbie's "Shadow day" they are NOT to handle the mail. They can only WATCH!
gotstamps -- "WHY is she running routes without ANY training???"
-- one can thank the current contract for that happening.
-- Management's Rights - Article 3. The Employer shall have the exclusive tight: f. To take whatever actions are necessary to carry out its mission in emergency situations; i.e., an unforeseen circumstance or a combination of circumstances which calls for immediate action in a situation which is not expected to be of a recurring nature. ( we all know the definition of "emergency" usually differs between manglement and labor )
-- Page 48 of the current contract: 4. If no qualified substitutes, rural carrier associates, or rural carrier relief employees within the delivery unit are available, the Employer may designate any other leave replacement in the office prior to selecting a regular rural carrier to work in accordance with Article 8.5 . </blockquote>
They still have to be trained for postal work! Even ARCs get some sort of training! This is why on a newbie's "Shadow day" they are NOT to handle the mail. They can only WATCH!
Rowdylane29
New member
<span style="text-decoration: underline">Just wondering..I filled out a leave slip and was told he can not okay it because he has to wait to see if anyone with AL wants the day first because they have the right to it. Was told RCAs have no right to time off because we don't earn leave? Is this true</span>
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Rowdylane29 said </strong>
<span style="text-decoration: underline">Just wondering..I filled out a leave slip and was told he can not okay it because he has to wait to see if anyone with AL wants the day first because they have the right to it. Was told RCAs have no right to time off because we don't earn leave? Is this true</span> </blockquote>
Rowdylane 29.......
Read # 3 above from <a class="spLink spProfilePage" title="" href="https://www.ruralmailtalk.ruralinfo.net/forum/profile/2513/">Deer Smearer</a> he absolutely correct....
<strong>A RCA may request to take leave or a non scheduled day. This should be requested on a PS3971 as any other carrier would. </strong>
<strong>The block ‘Other’ would be the correct request.</strong>
<span style="text-decoration: underline">Just wondering..I filled out a leave slip and was told he can not okay it because he has to wait to see if anyone with AL wants the day first because they have the right to it. Was told RCAs have no right to time off because we don't earn leave? Is this true</span> </blockquote>
Rowdylane 29.......
Read # 3 above from <a class="spLink spProfilePage" title="" href="https://www.ruralmailtalk.ruralinfo.net/forum/profile/2513/">Deer Smearer</a> he absolutely correct....
<strong>A RCA may request to take leave or a non scheduled day. This should be requested on a PS3971 as any other carrier would. </strong>
<strong>The block ‘Other’ would be the correct request.</strong>
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Rt2mailman said </strong>
Secondly, any rca can trade work days with their regular, if that day is used during the same week. The process to do, and denote this is to have the rca request the day off on the leave slip, and the regular to sign in the comment section with the day they will take in exchange.</blockquote>
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">The only time an RCA can trade work days with their regular, is if no other RCA's are available to work. The RCA should request the day off, then, if management indicates that all the other RCA's are unavailable, without utilizing the RDWL, the regular carrier can agree to work the day. </blockquote>
Secondly, any rca can trade work days with their regular, if that day is used during the same week. The process to do, and denote this is to have the rca request the day off on the leave slip, and the regular to sign in the comment section with the day they will take in exchange.</blockquote>
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">The only time an RCA can trade work days with their regular, is if no other RCA's are available to work. The RCA should request the day off, then, if management indicates that all the other RCA's are unavailable, without utilizing the RDWL, the regular carrier can agree to work the day. </blockquote>
Rt2mailman
Well-known member
jerrylann, An RCA and the regular that they work for can trade days off anytime they want, as long as the day "earned" by the regular is used in the same pay period. No other carrier can be involved when a mutual trade of days is involved.
