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Primary is Out

Cliff Clavin

Cliff Clavin

Moderator
Staff member
Ok, now the <strong>Regular</strong> on my <strong>Primary</strong> <strong>Route </strong>is out for the rest of the year as of tomorrow because of an injury <strong>do I get to run this, my primary route, everyday 6 days a week?</strong> ( I don't mind and hope so)

With all the Amazon packages and other packages that we get on this route and the extremly large increase volume of mail since mail count, neither the regular nor myself have been able to run this route under evaluation (9/day) since September.

The PM is pissed and rides both of us daily (hurry up and get out, hurry up and get in). We have both told the PM in September that we have had an additional 40 houses built on our route but they don't care.

When I have to run this route 6 days a week I know I will be over 60 hours just on my route. Then I have had to run Amazon every Sunday and holiday since it started.

Yes I tired! I am more tired of them trying to screw me out of the hours that I actually work every pay period. I have to bring it to their attention every single payday that I am short hours. Their explanation is they will add it in on the next check. Totally unprofessional and most likely illeagl.
 
40 new deliveries recently.  For starters, (even though this is not what you want to do during the busiest time of the year), it has to be done if the edit book isn't up to date.  Get out the red book, and check to make sure that those deliveries are in there as active.  Also find the 4003, and make sure that those deliveries are in the list for those roads, with the appropriate mileage.  If neither of these are, update them and tell the delivery supervisor that it needs to be submitted and corrected by the end of the week.  Your route is probably being under evaluated by 2-3 hours a week depending on what your volume factor is.  In that case, both you and the regular have been getting screwed.  Double and triple check the red book before you bring this up to mgt.  40 new deliveries is HUGE, and is a big loss in your pocket, and the change in time alone would help to get management off your backs.  Hopefully these deliveries are in there, but some regulars don't know how to keep their edit book up to date.  Good luck. 
 
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<strong>Shafted said </strong>
40 new deliveries recently.  For starters, (even though this is not what you want to do during the busiest time of the year), it has to be done if the edit book isn't up to date.  Get out the red book, and check to make sure that those deliveries are in there as active.  Also find the 4003, and make sure that those deliveries are in the list for those roads, with the appropriate mileage.  If neither of these are, update them and tell the delivery supervisor that it needs to be submitted and corrected by the end of the week.  Your route is probably being under evaluated by 2-3 hours a week depending on what your volume factor is.  In that case, both you and the regular have been getting screwed.  Double and triple check the red book before you bring this up to mgt.  40 new deliveries is HUGE, and is a big loss in your pocket, and the change in time alone would help to get management off your backs.  Hopefully these deliveries are in there, but some regulars don't know how to keep their edit book up to date.  Good luck.   

</blockquote>
I'll have to check those things.

Will I get to run this route 6 days a week? I hope so, I want the OT
 
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Cliff Clavin said </strong>
Ok, now the <strong>Regular</strong> on my <strong>Primary</strong> <strong>Route </strong>is out for the rest of the year as of tomorrow because of an injury <strong>do I get to run this, my primary route, everyday 6 days a week?</strong> ( I don't mind and hope so)
  hours a day. 9
With all the Amazon packages and other packages that we get on this route and the extremly large increase volume of mail since mail count, neither the regular nor myself have been able to run this route under evaluation (9/day) since September.

The PM is pissed and rides both of us daily (hurry up and get out, hurry up and get in). We have both told the PM in September that we have had an additional 40 houses built on our route but they don't care.

When I have to run this route 6 days a week I know I will be over 60 hours just on my route. Then I have had to run Amazon every Sunday and holiday since it started.

Yes I tired! I am more tired of them trying to screw me out of the hours that I actually work every pay period. I have to bring it to their attention every single payday that I am short hours. Their explanation is they will add it in on the next check. Totally unprofessional and most likely illeagl.  </blockquote>
The 6 days depends on the route classification. You are entitled to run the route up to the evaluation of the route weekly. If going over 40 hours you get overtime for those hours over 40.

As for the 6 days, if it is an H route yes.

Lets say it is a 45K with a Saturday relief day. It has a weekly evaluation of 9 hours a day.You should have already worked Saturday. If you didn't work today you are entitle to work the route Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday... up to 45 hours for the week minimum. Once you reach 45 hours they can replace you.

Now, for the next 2 weeks you are entitled to 5 days or 45 hours on the route. Amazon Sunday is not part of the 45 hours. So you are entitled to 5 of the six days. You can request, or they can mandate a relief day if another sub is available, and it can be any of the days during the week. Since the week starting the 24th includes the Christmas holiday you get all 5 days up to at least 45 hours. Same for the next week for New Years.

As for missed hours they should be done as a payroll adjustment, not a falsification of hours the next week.
 
It's a 45K with Saturday relief day.

So I will get to work at least 5 days of the 6 even if it puts me over 45 hours, is that correct?

I can tell you for sure no subs will <span style="text-decoration: underline"><strong>volunteer</strong></span> for this route as it is the hardest in the PO but I have been doing it so many years I love it although it is a tough route.
 
Well, seeing that you are a 45 k, I have a whole new concern.  If the regular carrier purposely did not update the red book, and those 40 boxes have not been added deliberately because he/ she doesn't want to risk a 47 or 48 k classification, or a route adjustment cut, that's just plain bullshit.  A regular doing that means they are wanting the both of you to deliver those boxes for free.  I worked with a  regular who played the over/under edit book game.  I hope this isn't the situation for your route.  
 
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Cliff Clavin said </strong>
It's a 45K with Saturday relief day.

So I will get to work at least 5 days of the 6 even if it puts me over 45 hours, is that correct?  </blockquote>
They could limit you to 45 hours on the primary. Amazon doesn't count towards the 45.
 
And if that is the case I would get the book corrected as a nice big "thanks a$$?&!@" Xmas present for them when they return.  Deliberately falsifying the edit book, and delivering boxes for free, to escape an adjustment is just plain wrong.  It's not just he or she that is delivering those 40 boxes for free, it's YOU as well.  I do hope those boxes are in the edit book.  
 
Other subs may not volunteer, but they can possibly be required. They could even have you sort and case the route for another sub to run as long as you get the minimum of 2 hours for the day. Usually more volunteers for cased and sorted routes.
 
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Shafted said </strong>
Well, seeing that you are a 45 k, I have a whole new concern.  If the regular carrier purposely did not update the red book, and those 40 boxes have not been added deliberately because he/ she doesn't want to risk a 47 or 48 k classification, or a route adjustment cut, that's just plain bullshit.  A regular doing that means they are wanting the both of you to deliver those boxes for free.  I worked with a  regular who played the over/under edit book game.  I hope this isn't the situation for your route.    </blockquote>
No both he and I have told Mgt about the increase. He asked them in Sept o cut the route because it has grown so much since mail count, not including all the packages that we didn't have during mail count.
 
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<strong>Deer Smearer said </strong>
Other subs may not volunteer, but they can possibly be required. They could even have you sort and case the route for another sub to run as long as you get the minimum of 2 hours for the day. Usually more volunteers for cased and sorted routes.  

</blockquote>
I have no problem with that. I know I will have to case it because no one else knows the route or the case.

I just don't want them making me run Amazon on Sunday for 5 or so hours and then when I get close to 40 on my route they do like they did last week and pull me off after only running 3 or 4 days since this time it will be my primary route that I am running. 
 
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Cliff Clavin said </strong>
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<strong>Deer Smearer said </strong>
Other subs may not volunteer, but they can possibly be required. They could even have you sort and case the route for another sub to run as long as you get the minimum of 2 hours for the day. Usually more volunteers for cased and sorted routes.  
</blockquote>

I have no problem with that. I know I will have to case it because no one else knows the route or the case.

I just don't want them making me run Amazon on Sunday for 5 or so hours and then when I get close to 40 on my route they do like they did last week and pull me off after only running 3 or 4 days since this time it will be my primary route that I am running.   </blockquote>
They can't pull you off your primary before you hit evaluation. 
 
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Deer Smearer said </strong>

They can't pull you off your primary before you hit evaluation.   </blockquote>
Can you or anyone here on the Forum show me some sort of rule that says they can't pull me off my Primary before the evaluation since the Regular is out and I have ran it everyday up to today?

The reason I am asking is because the PM said that I have to take Thursday and Friday off. At this point I will not have worked the evaluated hours until sometime in the day on Thursday. Perhaps if they let me case the route on Thursday it will bring me at or very close to the evaluated time.

The PM said that the Amazon hours from Sunday count towards my hours on my Primary route and I told them "No it doesn't".
 
what you want to refer your PM to is Article 30.2.O

      Leave Replacement Working Evaluated Hours

When a substitute,RCA, or RCR employee assigned to a route is working the route as a leave replacement or serving full time on a vacant route,

or where the carrier is on extended leave, the employee is entitled to work at least the evaluated hours of the assigned route and then may be

replaced to avoid payment of overtime or additional overtime
 
The part about "overtime or additional overtime " is confusing to many managers. It means if the route is a 40k (no overtime will be paid), if the route is anything above  40 (45k for example) no additional (beyond the 5 overtime hours) will be paid. It would be best if your pm finds someone else to do Sunday work or he will be paying you overtime for each Sunday hour you work.

You must work all 5 days at least 2 hours/day to qualify for the entire week of work, if you "allow" your pm to work you less (days) you lose all the entitled hours because you didn't work the entire week. By the way from the manager's training on Christmas (underhanded) overtime this is their plan this year due to the excessive hours being worked by all carriers due to Amazon.
 
<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Rt2mailman said </strong>
The part about "overtime or additional overtime " is confusing to many managers. It means if the route is a 40k (no overtime will be paid), if the route is anything above  40 (45k for example) no additional (beyond the 5 overtime hours) will be paid. It would be best if your pm finds someone else to do Sunday work or he will be paying you overtime for each Sunday hour you work.

You must work <strong>all 5 days at least 2 hours/day to qualify for the entire week of work, if you "allow" your pm to work you less (days) you lose all the entitled hours because you didn't work the entire week.</strong> By the way from the manager's training on Christmas (underhanded) overtime this is their plan this year due to the excessive hours being worked by all carriers due to Amazon.  </blockquote>
So you are telling me that I have to work <strong>ALL 5days</strong> at least 2hrs a day to <strong>qualify</strong> for the entire week of work.

Not sure what you mean by <strong>qualify. </strong>After tomorrow, Wednesday, I will already have 43 of the 45 hours on the route. So you are saying that I have to work Thursday and Friday at least 2 hours each day to be <strong>qualified</strong> for the week. That would put me at 47 hours on this route which would put me 2 hours past the 45 hours. That hardly makes any sense and I am absolutely sure they won't go for that.
 
I don't think that you will be able to work this week to your advantage. If you work two hours on Wednesday your pm will send you home because that is the evaluation number you are entitled to for the week, but you worked those hours in three days, so you will be paid the evaluation of the route for each of those three days and nothing for the rest of the week. If your pm puts the hours in the way he was trained for this Christmas season that is the way it will come out. Some PM's have morals and will put your hours in for each day and cover you for the week, but don't hold your breath, most won't. If you don't work all 5 days,you didn't work the whole week, which is when you receive the entitlement of the evaluated hours for the week, "qualify".

Something is not correct in what you are telling us, if you worked 43 hours in 3 days (Saturday,Monday,&Tuesday ) you've worked 14.3 hours/day where any hours over 12 are overtime already. I think you are adding your Sunday hours onto your route evaluation hours, which is incorrect. Sunday hours are separate and paid extra and on top of your evaluation hours, that is why I said above that each Sunday hour you work will be overtime pay, because your pm first has to give you your 45 on the route for the week of work. I'm guessing that you worked 7 hours on Sunday and then 12 hours each day on the route to get to 43. If that is so, you have 9 hours left to work on Wednesday and Thursday @4.5/day that should work out nicely. 45 entitled hours (40 straight pay, 5 overtime pay) and 7 Sunday hours at overtime since you've already worked over 40. 
 
<strong>Rt2mailman</strong>

If you read my post again, what I said was: "<strong>After tomorrow, Wednesday,</strong> I will already have 43 of the 45 hours on the route." So that makes me having worked <strong>4 days,</strong> Saturday, Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday and yes one of those days was over 12 hrs. Also, I <span style="text-decoration: underline">have not</span> added the Sunday hours onto my route evaluation hours.

The 5th day will be Thursday since I have already worked Saturday, Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday and on my 5th day of working (Thursday) I will only need 2 to 3.25 hours to be at my 45 hours <strong>for the route evaluation.</strong> 
 
Sorry, I didn't realize you were adding future hours in for one day. You should be fine then, the overtime hours from working over 12 don't count because they were already paid overtime for being over 12. As long as you are able to work 2 hours on the 5th day that you work on a weekly route you have satisfied ,"qualified", for the weekly evaluation of that route. The Sunday hours and the over 12 hours will be sent in as overtime hours, so you should end up with at least 10 overtime hours and 40 straight hours on your check. The training for the managers this year has been such that if they can "catch" a sub or more likely a regular they can slip some ot away from them. This is how they will attempt to do it, work the carrier until they are out of evaluation hours before the 5th day of work, convince the carrier that they don't have to come in on Friday or in your case Thursday, give the carrier a LWOP day, and now you haven't  worked the entire week so you just get the daily evaluation X 4days. All carriers must be there 5 days to get  Christmas overtime or as an RCA overtime for hours over 40. If it is only four days that you are there you will get the evaluation X 4.
 
<strong>Rt2mailman</strong>

Well I guess the case is closed. Having worked 4 days on the route the PM said that I will be off Thursday and Friday, no if's and's or but's.

PM states that the Sunday time counts, I know they are wrong but at this point it doesn't matter. I worked 44 of the 45 hours on the route and of course the Sunday hours, so I should have 40 regular and 12 OT. So I'm good.

With that being said, I would have been pi**ed if they had pulled me off yesterday after 3 days on the route and not letting me get close to the eval hours. Having worked 4 days on the route at least I did get close to the eval hours.

I love my job and I am indeed good at it. When the chips are down and they are in a bind I am the one they turn to.

Merry Christmas <strong>Rt2mailman </strong>and <strong>Everyone</strong> here on <strong>Rural Mail Talk</strong>
 
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