Removed from Aux route for one day because I worked too many consecutive days

[mariomail]

I have a question.

I put a hold down on aux route end of last year. I work in a small office where I would never work amazon sunday, now that I am on a aux route, I have due to emergencies, call-outs, etc. However I do go into a rather large office to work amazon Sunday to get extra hours. They never have enough help so they welcome me with open arms.  My aux route is evaluated at 30 hours. So the extra hours are much needed.

I was told by my postmaster (whom he was told by his superiors) that I was on a report for working 41 consecutive days and that I MUST take LWOP for a Tuesday. I am filing a grievance but wanted the opinions of others. About consecutive days, being removed from a work day in which I have a hold down on a route, etc. Thanks

 

[Howah44]

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<strong>mariomail said </strong>
I have a question.

I put a hold down on aux route end of last year. I work in a small office where I would never work amazon sunday, now that I am on a aux route, I have due to emergencies, call-outs, etc. However I do go into a rather large office to work amazon Sunday to get extra hours. They never have enough help so they welcome me with open arms.  My aux route is evaluated at 30 hours. So the extra hours are much needed.

I was told by my postmaster (whom he was told by his superiors) that I was on a report for working 41 consecutive days and that I MUST take LWOP for a Tuesday. I am filing a grievance but wanted the opinions of others. About consecutive days, being removed from a work day in which I have a hold down on a route, etc. Thanks  

</blockquote>
 

Mgt is really on the ball in your situation.  They have a rule where I am,  that ppl cant work more than 10 days straight (I think), usually due to the lack of help, its rarely followed.  However, if it happens to suit mgt needs at the moment they enforce it.

 

Someone where I work filed a grievance due to the situaton you describe above, and won,  This person ended up being told no Amazon work insteard of a violation of the contract.

 

[mariomail]

Yes i am learning management does what suits them at the time.

My postmaster talked to his boss who told him to have me take LWOP that I can work 2 Sundays on and one off. I cannot work over 14 days in a row.

I contacted the union. Some of them helpful some not so much. I was basically told they should've told me to take the upcoming Sunday off and never had removed me from my route.

I am currently filing a grievance to receive my pay for that one LWOP day.

 

[btdtret]

mariomail -- "I was told by my postmaster (whom he was told by his superiors) that I was on a report for working 41 consecutive days"

--  Politely ask for the reference limiting your consecutive number of work days.  Others subs have posted working daily for months on end - probably in sub-short offices.   

--  Would not be surprised that manglement is more worried about you getting over-time, than the number of consecutive days you work.

--  Politely remind manglement that THEY DO THE SCHEDULING, not you.  If they can't keep track of your work hours, not your problem.

--  Worst thing that can happen is manglement will inform the larger post office with Amazon Sundays is that you are no longer "available".  Should that happen, make sure YOUR manglement makes the change to remove your name form the "volunteer list" and put your name put on the "non-volunteer list".  Ask that manglement have some type of note added to the lists indicating it was manglement and not you who made the change(s).  Don't need another office putting you "on report"  ( have a military back ground? ) for not being "available".

"I MUST take LWOP for a Tuesday."

--  Get a hold of your Assistant District Representative about that -- if possible.

--  Let's "assume" that you have not put in a 3791 ( Request for or Notification of Absence ) for LWOP yet.  "Technically" you are still scheduled to work, so show up anyways because of you don't have a 3791 submitted, manglement might try to list you as "AWOL", which will lead to additional paper work for all concerned.   With no 3791 submitted, manglement's saying you are on LWOP won't mean anything -- official wise.   

--  If you really want to get on manglement's bad side ( even further ), if told to go home when you arrive, check the work schedule.   If on the schedule and you showed up for work, you are guaranteed two hours of work.   Page 4 of the contract.

--  Have you worked 90 calendar days on the AUX?

--  If so, do you have a Form 50 changing your Designation to 79?  ( now earning annual and sick leave )

--  Did manglement say why you could not take annual leave instead of LWOP?   Could it be manglement "forgot" to submit your 90-Day paperwork?

--  "Howah44" is fortunate to have the "10-day rule".   Some state labor laws also address the number of consecutive days worked, but manglement will say that does not apply to postal personnel.

--  Good luck.

 

"Howah44"  -- does manglement have any reference to back up that 10-consecutive day rule, or something they made up?

 

[mariomail]

This happened last week but after reading your reply I should've shown up on that day I was told to take off. I thought about it and since I work in a small office which everyone gets along I just complied. But seeing your post I should've shown up on that day and be told to go home. I believe I have a winnable grievance but I see where you are coming from with 2 hours of pay and actually being told go home and being on a schedule.

 

[btdtret]

mariomail -- Okay -- water under the bridge.   You will have some options in case there is a "next time".

--  Was your name still on the schedule for the day you took off?

--  Did you submit a 3791?

--  How did manglement list your "absence"?

--  Manglement say anything about future work at the Amazon office?

--  Still ask for their reference as I sure others would be interested.

 

[mariomail]

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>btdtret said </strong>
mariomail -- Okay -- water under the bridge.   You will have some options in case there is a "next time".

--  Was your name still on the schedule for the day you took off?

--  Did you submit a 3791?

--  How did manglement list your "absence"?

--  Manglement say anything about future work at the Amazon office?

--  Still ask for their reference as I sure others would be interested.  </blockquote>
My name was still on schedule.

I did not submit a 3791

How do you mean "how did they list my absence?" As in when putting in the time for the RCA who worked for me?

I was told on the day I was told I had to take LWOP that my PM supervisors said I could work 2 Sundays on and 1 off as long as I don't work 15 days in a row. I could however work 14 max.  I did discuss my grievance with my PM and he did a 360 and gave me crap. Admitting that I shouldn't have been taken off the route and I should win grievance. Even though he complied with orders he knew were wrong. But then told me I possibly couldn't work in other offices because I can't work pass 60 hours (I was only working 45 hours a week in 7 days - Aux route I usually get off by 1-2pm). And I couldn't work so many consecutive days. When I turned it on him and said well I won't work Sundays and since I get off early I would go to the larger office and work during the week. This larger office encourages me to come in whenever I want; will never be turned away. Then he mentioned overtime and that I have been going over evaluation time and that he will push my starting time forward and that he won't pay for my overtime for going in a larger office (even though he told me many times the larger office pays ot; don't know if that's true). I have been going over evaluation but it's because of amazon and the route was last counted when there wasn't amazon. He knows that. I get along fine with him but that last conversation ticked me off.

 

As in what reference?

 

[btdtret]

mariomail -- ""How do you mean “how did they list my absence?” "

--  If you were on the schedule to work but did not show up, manglement should have listed a reason why you were not at work.  As in "AWOL" if there was no 3791 submitted for your manglement mandated "LWOP" day.   Even manglement likes to cover their "assets" with a paper trail.

--  Just because manglement tells you to stay home -- there has to be a paper trail.

--  God forbid you had an accident away from the office while you were on the schedule to work.  Would have been interesting to see manglement scramble to explain your situation to higher ups.

"I did discuss my grievance with my PM and he did a 360 and gave me crap. Admitting that I shouldn’t have been taken off the route and I should win grievance. "

--  "he did a 360" means the PM did not change his view at all -- IMHO.

--  The PM should be talking to the member of manglement who told you to stay home.

--  Now you have manglement worried, and with good cause.   Manglement hates to have ADR's poking around the office as the ADR could stumble on some other manglement malfeasance!

--  If manglement will not or more likely, can not produce their "work-day limitation" reference, have the ADR ask for it.

--  Since you are getting along well with the larger office, inquire about a transfer to it.   As long as you are past your probationary period of 90-work days or one calendar year, you can request to transfer.  Check out page 48 of the contract and also Step 4 ( P-115 ).  Especially P-115:  in part -- RCA's who have completed their probationary period may request a transfer in accordance with Article 30.2.F.   If the gaining office accepts the employee's request for transfer, the losing office MUST release the RCA.   The transfer will be effective WITHIN 30 days of the notification to the losing office.

--  Guess you should be asking the larger office manglement personnel if they have a limit on consecutive days working / approximately how many work hours to expect should you transfer / chances to get an AUX / how many positions open on the Matrix.

--  Can you afford to give up the AUX?

--  Just mentioning you are considering a transfer MIGHT get you some better treatment at your current office.

 

[btdtret]

mariomail -- "How do you mean “how did they list my absence?” As in when putting in the time for the RCA who worked for me?"

--  Don't know if this will help or not.

--  Someone at Eagan ( USPS Payroll Center ) does your pay records, including pay, EMA, annual leave, sick leave, and yes LWOP.  What ever is listed on the pay stub come from Eagan.

--  That someone notices a new ID number on a day that you have normally worked.   Makes a note to see why it was not your ID number.  Looks at the local pay entry data expecting to see an "annual leave", "sick leave" or "LWOP" entry but does not find anything.   To me, anyways, that should raise a "red flag" and that could / should lead to a call to your PM or worse, the District Head, for additional information.  In theory anyways. 

--  Should someone from District show up at your office for a closer look -- there you are:  your name is on the work schedule, but you did not work because you were not if the office.   Worse yet, there is no 3971 on file regarding your absence and no excuse for not being at work aside from you were "told" by manglement to stay home.   

--  Maybe your PM will stand up to District personnel and say -- "Hey, you told me the carrier was working too much and I told the carrier to stay home."

 

[mariomail]

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>btdtret said </strong>
mariomail -- "How do you mean “how did they list my absence?” As in when putting in the time for the RCA who worked for me?"

--  Don't know if this will help or not.

--  Someone at Eagan ( USPS Payroll Center ) does your pay records, including pay, EMA, annual leave, sick leave, and yes LWOP.  What ever is listed on the pay stub come from Eagan.

--  That someone notices a new ID number on a day that you have normally worked.   Makes a note to see why it was not your ID number.  Looks at the local pay entry data expecting to see an "annual leave", "sick leave" or "LWOP" entry but does not find anything.   To me, anyways, that should raise a "red flag" and that could / should lead to a call to your PM or worse, the District Head, for additional information.  In theory anyways. 

--  Should someone from District show up at your office for a closer look -- there you are:  your name is on the work schedule, but you did not work because you were not if the office.   Worse yet, there is no 3971 on file regarding your absence and no excuse for not being at work aside from you were "told" by manglement to stay home.   

--  Maybe your PM will stand up to District personnel and say -- "Hey, you told me the carrier was working too much and I told the carrier to stay home."  </blockquote>
Yes I see. Thanks for the great information

 

[mariomail]

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>mariomail said </strong>

Yes I see. Thanks for the great information  </blockquote>
I'll check my paystub on Tuesday. My steward asked for a copy of my paystub along with the grievance papers.

After the back and forth about hours, days, etc I did tell him I'll see how the mail count goes for my route and if that doesn't turn well I'll consider a transfer. To which he responded that a carrier plans to retire in July so just wait.

 

[Aux01]

I thought management could hold you at 40 hrs but not limit you by number of days?

 

[btdtret]

mariomail -- "I did tell him I’ll see how the mail count goes for my route and if that doesn’t turn well I’ll consider a transfer. To which he responded that a carrier plans to retire in July so just wait."

--  Wow -- that did not take long for the PM to be "nice"!

--  However - comma - unless you are:

a.  the senior RCA in the office, and

b.  bid correctly, and

c.  no other regular carrier in the office bids on that route opening in July, and

d.  there is no excessed regular carrier within 100 miles, and

e.  the regular carrier really does retire in July,

there is no guarantee you'll get the route.

 

[mariomail]

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>btdtret said </strong>
mariomail -- "I did tell him I’ll see how the mail count goes for my route and if that doesn’t turn well I’ll consider a transfer. To which he responded that a carrier plans to retire in July so just wait."

--  Wow -- that did not take long for the PM to be "nice"!

--  However - comma - unless you are:

a.  the senior RCA in the office, and

b.  bid correctly, and

c.  no other regular carrier in the office bids on that route opening in July, and

d.  there is no excessed regular carrier within 100 miles, and

e.  the regular carrier really does retire in July,

there is no guarantee you'll get the route.  </blockquote>
Yeah I'm the senior RCA.

I'm just gonna file for my one day of pay.

I'm new to grievances does anyone know if you get your day of pay or do you, would you request something else?

I realized in this short time that the union (at least in my area) don't really care about representing us. The few times I talked them it came off as I was disturbing their day. Really unbelievable. For example my local steward told me I had no case (for being pulled off my route). Didn't buy it so I contacted my ADR and he said I had a case and they should've told me to take the upcoming Sunday off. He said they can control hours, overtime, consecutive days, etc.

Whatever, I'll file my little grievance and then hope I don't have to file anymore. Not sure I want to stay in the post office for 30 years.

 

[Deer Smearer]

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">
<strong>mariomail said </strong>

Yeah I'm the senior RCA.

I'm just gonna file for my one day of pay.

I'm new to grievances does anyone know if you get your day of pay or do you, would you request something else?

I realized in this short time that the union (at least in my area) don't really care about representing us. The few times I talked them it came off as I was disturbing their day. Really unbelievable. For example my local steward told me I had no case (for being pulled off my route). Didn't buy it so I contacted my ADR and he said I had a case and they should've told me to take the upcoming Sunday off. He said they can control hours, overtime, consecutive days, etc.

Whatever, I'll file my little grievance and then hope I don't have to file anymore. Not sure I want to stay in the post office for 30 years.  

</blockquote>
You simply file the grievance in the form of a question. The union rep basically takes it from there.

Make sure that in addition to lost pay that you are also credited with appropriate sick and annual leave. 

The pay should also be at the overtime rate if warranted.

 

[Shafted]

Any good grievance also throws in a cease and desist order, with a money penalty to keep it from happening again.

 

[mariomail]

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>Shafted said </strong>
Any good grievance also throws in a cease and desist order, with a money penalty to keep it from happening again.  </blockquote>
Just another question ... would I discuss this (money penalty, credit with appropriate sick/annual leave, etc.) with union rep once papers are turned in?

 

[gotstamps]

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote"><strong>mariomail said </strong>

Just another question ... would I discuss this (money penalty, credit with appropriate sick/annual leave, etc.) with union rep once papers are turned in?  </blockquote>
You can discuss it with your union rep, but it is on them to decide the remedy. Once you file that grievance, it belongs to the Union. A good rep will keep you abreast of it's progress and to what was agreed as the solution. This should be very cut & dry as there is nothing in our contract that limits the amount of days in a row but it does state that route schedule comes before Amazon Sunday schedule. Those on Aux & hold-downs should not be scheduled on Sundays if mgmt wants them to not work "X" days in a row. Our mgmt says no to the 7th day. It is frustrating when a sub gets mad over being passed over due to this "7th day" rule & then does NOT file a grievance.