Case DPS or take it to the street?

Ihatesnow · Feb 5, 2017

Didn't wanna make a new forum topic so I thought I would post my question here.

So I'm an rca, start time is 8, I'm ready to pull down by 930 and the accountables, gas card is never ready and I have to wait about a half hour everyday. Clerks have finally complained to manglement that im bothering thm and they're thinking about pushing only my start time back to 830 or even later. There are 2 other carriers who also have to wait but their routes start very close to the post office so they leave and come back, I can't. I always wanted to take dps to the street but I case everything and its still not ready so that's not even close to realistic. So I guess my question is, am I supposed to be having to wait every day on the clerks? Are they allowed to push my start time back only? Do I have any recourse?

LouSainus · Feb 5, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">Ihatesnow said 
Didn't wanna make a new forum topic so I thought I would post my question here.

So I'm an rca, start time is 8, I'm ready to pull down by 930 and the accountables, gas card is never ready and I have to wait about a half hour everyday. Clerks have finally complained to manglement that im bothering thm and they're thinking about pushing only my start time back to 830 or even later. There are 2 other carriers who also have to wait but their routes start very close to the post office so they leave and come back, I can't. I always wanted to take dps to the street but I case everything and its still not ready so that's not even close to realistic. So I guess my question is, am I supposed to be having to wait every day on the clerks? Are they allowed to push my start time back only? Do I have any recourse? </blockquote>
What? You should be getting paid on green card time for any waiting that is not normal. I doubt during count they gave each route 30 mins a day of column 17 time for waiting on accountables. IIRC the contract states that 95% of mail should be distributed by the time the carriers come in not the time they are leaving. If the clerks cant do their job in the 90 mins they have from the time you start to the time you need your keys they need to hire more clerks. Also the carriers leaving and coming back are not doing their jobs correctly.

mrsreese · Feb 5, 2017

Thank you for all the suggestions, it is a heavy route I also have a subdivision that takes 2 hours to do. I want to get faster I guess with time it will come. I have about 6 cases of dps and about 4 tubs of flats, some days I'm find but I feel horrible when they have to send someone to help me I feel like I'm never going to get it.

Diana_of_Themyscira · Feb 5, 2017

For the first few months, I was hell-bent on casing the DPS. I want everything organized and neat. Consequently, I was always the last one to leave the office. Of course, I got help from other RCAs, and boy, how they love running my route saying, "I like the way you case; it makes delivery a LOT easier!" SO they would grab a tray or two from me and get done with it quick and call me again if I need more help. That went on for a bit until I decided I didn't want help and should do it on my own. One boss went emphatic with me and made me take the DPS to the street ! I have to admit, I abhorred him that day, and in my mind, called him names !

BUT, that day REALLY changed the way I did my "system" .
I was surprised I got back quicker and got the job done easier. I needed to know the reason why it went that way.
Then it dawned on me that it takes extra time to - flip through the letters, put them in the case, pull them down, put them in the tray, load them, flip through them again, and finally put them in mailboxes.

As opposed to taking it to the street - you only take time to load the trays, flip through the letters, put them in mailboxes !

But of course, I still go through the DPS, to take the mails out for the VACATION HOLDS and FORWARDS.
I also take the box holders to the street - addressed or not ! It would definitely take me almost a couple of hours casing them. I would rather spend that time putting them in mailboxes, where they would eventually go anyway.

Even up to this day, I still thank my boss for making me do it !

klutz · Feb 5, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">wolfound said 

maybe its just me then.......we all start at 730...save the J and he begins @745....and are lucky if the morning truck has arrived before we do. Hurry up and wait.Its not my fault the distribution plants are consolidated and the truck is late more oft than not. Give me a proper adjustment on when I am supposed to leave for the route. Not ten minutes after the late truck gets here just because my evalu says I gotta hit by 9:12. Maybe I am twisted in thinking it is a faster, more concise way of doing things when everything you need to make a complete and successful delivery is all together in one spot. Maybe because I was not trained any other way but to case it all. Maybe because I think sitting offside the road sorting thru trays and tubs of mail in a vehicle that leaks exhaust fumes in the cab isn't really a smart thing to do. Maybe because I don't like semis roaring by me at 65 miles an hour while I fumble around digging the out of town mail from my DPS trays. Maybe because I don't screw around and take 40 minute lunches, four 15 minute smoke breaks, have 'hen parties' with the other carriers, or find other ways to waste time in the office when i could be casing. But i do know that I strive to do my best each and every day I work. I find it shameful to bring back anything undelivered, save that for which I need a signature.And I can count on one hand the actual times I have failed to make evening dispatch. {{I am but an RCA, so making weekly evaluated time is not a problem. yet, I have run 6 days, 5 days...straight and know that it all seems to balance out in the end addition of daily times.}} So, Maybe I think too much about the unequality of top heavy management breathing down my neck, while the office "pets" do as they please. And maybe i speak too freely about things i shouldn't. I've been bit** slapped before in the forums.....right or wrong....and this is most certainly my opinion of taking DPS to the street. </blockquote>
Hit the nail on the head....nothing arrives on time......SAFETY......doing as much as possible inside is so logically superior to screwing around on the side of the road just waiting for an accident to happen. Leave time is laughable....No even flow of mail and late trucks preclude any normalcy. With inspector general admitting in EVERY audit of delivery operations that plants do not have or do not follow integrated operating plans it is obvious that "leave time" is a flat out joke.

Finally.....Has there ever been a study of casing vs taking to street? Not that I know of.

Boston65 · Feb 5, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">klutz said 

Hit the nail on the head....nothing arrives on time......SAFETY......doing as much as possible inside is so logically superior to screwing around on the side of the road just waiting for an accident to happen. Leave time is laughable....No even flow of mail and late trucks preclude any normalcy. With inspector general admitting in EVERY audit of delivery operations that plants do not have or do not follow integrated operating plans it is obvious that "leave time" is a flat out joke.

Finally.....Has there ever been a study of casing vs taking to street? Not that I know of. </blockquote>
There was a total of 19 studies for the Rural Study program. And yes casing was one of them. The final study should be starting back up very soon. It is the data base entry. Plotting 4 points for every delivery on a route.

stonehenge98 · Feb 6, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">klutz said 

Hit the nail on the head....nothing arrives on time......SAFETY......doing as much as possible inside is so logically superior to screwing around on the side of the road just waiting for an accident to happen.</blockquote>
Again, this idea of one way being definitively superior to the other in all manners and situations is absurd. Taking DPS to the street is not inherently unsafe. Sure it might take an extra second to reach over to grab the raw for the next box, but there is no "screwing around on the side of the road." It might not make sense how quickly you can work two bundles if you've never gotten good at it, but what do you think people are doing? Any 3Ms and endorsements are sorted in the office after running the route.

Personally, I do both, depending on the day/load/my mood, and I never feel any more safe or unsafe on the main highways I'm on, doing either one. Idiot drivers are idiot drivers and I stay diligent no matter the state of my DPS.

Shafted · Feb 6, 2017

I love seeing this particular topic come up year in and year out haha. It can be so hotly debated, but in the end it basically comes down to preference. It's the age old choice of Hellmans, or Miracle Whip. Everyone has a reason why they prefer one versus the other, and there is no right or wrong answer.

noluv4llv · Feb 6, 2017

I agree with Shafted. When you are new you have a system that you are used to and it takes time before you will be comfortable changing up how you do things. Sometimes you will have no choice, people (especially post masters and supervisors) love to give their two cents about how you should be casing and delivering and I have been made to do things differently and it's bologna. You know what you are comfortable with and eventually you will get good enough that you will start to try other ways and know how and when you should do what. One thing to keep in mind is if management or other carriers are pressuring you about your time please do not get worried and rush around out on the street. There is no one that needs their mail 30 minutes early that would justify you being in a wreck and hurting yourself or others because you are worried about time. Just like anything else the more you do something the better you will become. Your safety and wellbeing is way more important than outdated evaluation times.

Diana_of_Themyscira · Feb 6, 2017

different strokes for different folks !

wolfound · Feb 9, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">Shafted said 
I love seeing this particular topic come up year in and year out haha. It can be so hotly debated, but in the end it basically comes down to preference. It's the age old choice of Hellmans, or Miracle Whip. Everyone has a reason why they prefer one versus the other, and there is no right or wrong answer. </blockquote>
i prefer miracle whip......got my PDI for violating a direct order re: DPS to street. way past 14 day time frame, so was a bunch o' hot air. OIC main point is I disrespected her in front of the staff. How dare I!!! (HEY NOW.....did you PDI all the other carriers that waited for you to leave to go pick up express missorts at hub, then cased their DPS like mad before you got back? NO? why not? they defied your direct order too!!) Next direct order to take it to the street will find me in the dollar store parking lot sorting my mail.....I AM OUT OF OFFICE AND ON STREET just like you told me........ My stew just laughed when I asked him if I could do this....

???

Rt2mailman · Feb 9, 2017

Wolfhound, yes you can sort your DPS in a parking lot if you would like. Hopefully you were paid on an 8127 to listen to your pm "pdi" so it wasn't a complete waste of time, if not file and ask for that money. Not only should you do what you want with your DPS, you should inflict pain on your pm in the way of her going to the plant with your outgoing mail because you missed the truck, whenever she directs you to take it to the street.

csparks · Feb 9, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">mrsreese said 
Thank you for all the suggestions, it is a heavy route I also have a subdivision that takes 2 hours to do. I want to get faster I guess with time it will come. I have about 6 cases of dps and about 4 tubs of flats, some days I'm find but I feel horrible when they have to send someone to help me I feel like I'm never going to get it. </blockquote>
I believe you mentioned you've been at it about 2 months, tops right? You are doing fine. The fact that you are conscientious, and seeking to improve shows that you are a good hire. It is overwhelming at the beginning, more so than management can seem to admit. It was about where you are now that things begin to click for me. The repetition will do its job on the brain, and before long you'll begin to remember/anticipate/recognize names, numbers, turns, etc. It is not an easy job to do quickly, and without mistakes. It takes time.

IMO the training process is not really geared properly to get new people off to a sound start. I think they should forego much of the orientation fluff, and devote more days to training on the route.

wolfound · Feb 10, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">Rt2mailman said 
Wolfhound, yes you can sort your DPS in a parking lot if you would like. Hopefully you were paid on an 8127 to listen to your pm "pdi" so it wasn't a complete waste of time, if not file and ask for that money. Not only should you do what you want with your DPS, you should inflict pain on your pm in the way of her going to the plant with your outgoing mail because you missed the truck, whenever she directs you to take it to the street. </blockquote>
while the idea of inflicting pain sounds wonderful, I am sure it would come back to haunt me somehow. My PDI was more about me back talking and disrespecting her in front of everyone then it was about failing to follow a direct order. I was armed and ready with the Galligan letter, all the pages of the step four grievance regarding this matter. I told her that it had been grieved all the way up the ladder......she said " I don't care...I am talking about you.."I argued my point of it being unsafe to me to take it to the street. I pointed out that I was being singled out because I dared defy her, yet the other carriers that waited for her to leave, then cased their DPS were not given a reprimand. I told her she was looking at a harassment grievance if she kept it up. Then she dove into the christmas time fiasco she created....and I stopped her short saying ' its too late...that ship has sailed......" Meanwhile my stew is kicking me under the table and shaking his head nononono...... I do not like going against orders, but its so hard to take them from someone that has no clue what she is doing. This OIC couldn't manage a game of tic*tac*toe, let alone a post office. The number of customer complaints, last mile failures, carriers over evaluation, missing packages, and carrier misconduct is off the chart since she took over. The clerks are going crazy taking customer complaints all day long. Yet, she is oblivious to the downward spiral she has put this office in. I hope someone somewhere notices and steps in before we hit the bottom and implode.

Eeyore714 · Feb 12, 2017

So, I've been working like a lunatic and have finally had time to read all the responses. Thank you everyone for your advice and honest opinions. It does help me to get info from seasoned peers. I gather that the general consensus is do what is most efficient for you, safe for you and don't be afraid to try new ways. This is just what I do. In my situation, I do have a 1995 RHD Jeep Cherokee (I'm lucky to have found this because this is just my work car.) I took out the front passenger seat and put a table in that fits 2 bundles. My floor space in front of that, I can fit 6 bundles. Behind my table I put 2 buckets of spurs. Once one bucket is emptied, I place that in front of my table for collection. Usually I've already used most of the 6 bundles, so the bucket rim is even with my table. Works really nice, I usually put collected mail on my dash prior to that. I do 2 rows of mail bundles across my back seat, then any more bundles than that go across my cargo space in back.

Then it's tetris time for parcels! I put them in route order, (with end of the route going in first to the beginning), however, when I'm not on my primary route, I'll also put the case row number on the parcel. This helps especially on unfamiliar routes and if I happen to stop short for whatever reason and my parcels shift, I have an idea of when I have to deal with that package. In other words, if I'm in the beginning of the route and for some reason a parcel numbered 5 or 6 flies up front, I can throw it to the back. I previously used parcel markers, but that was one more thing for me to case. I now write a list, I star the "get outs" so I know I have to dismount for it.

DPS to the street-- I basically replace one bundle with a 1/2 tray of DPS that I rubber band in sections, ( a fist full). I'll have taken out the holds and forwards prior to this. I am in know way capable of remembering this when I'm on 5 routes, so I go by what the regular carrier has at their case for this info. So far I've done only 2 full trays of DPS on the street. My PM keeps telling me to take it to the street, I have to get faster. From November to now, I've missed dispatch 3 times and all 3 times, I was made to take DPS to the street. All 3 times I had high volume of everything, DPS, flats and parcels. I HATE taking DPS to the street! I only do it because I'm told to. I was told I would like it once I get use to it. So, I'm trying it but I still hate it! I know it adds time during delivery and that super stresses me from the get go. I'm constantly looking at my clock, I make more mistakes, I back track. And yes, spending more time at a box on busy main roads makes me feel unsafe. Yesterday, I had to get the hell out of the way for plow trucks coming through. They were edge plowing. They were booking it big time! Put it this way, I pulled fully into a driveway and they were so close, I could feel the paint peel off. Oh yes, I want to spend more time at a box, NOT!!! I'll keep practicing but I just prefer to case it all. Be safe everyone!!!

Lee Ruby · Feb 12, 2017

Management gets paid for taking holds out of DPS. PARS is supposed to take care of forwards. If that stuff is still in DPS that is on them. We don't get paid to case DPS. We don't get paid to pull it down. We barely get paid to handle it at all.

gotstamps · Feb 12, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">Lee Ruby said 
Management gets paid for taking holds out of DPS. PARS is supposed to take care of forwards. If that stuff is still in DPS that is on them. We don't get paid to case DPS. We don't get paid to pull it down. We barely get paid to handle it at all. </blockquote>
Mgmt does NOT get paid to take "holds" out of DPS. NEVER heard of such in the 12 yrs I've been here. Must be only in small offices. Certainly can't see them doing hold pulls in our office.

oi veh. · Feb 12, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">Lee Ruby said 
Management gets paid for taking holds out of DPS. PARS is supposed to take care of forwards. </blockquote>
Hell to the no! They most certainly do not. That stuff gets added to your raw during count. You are screwing yourself if you allow management to do this.

And gotstamps, I'm in a small office...has never happened in mine.

Lee Ruby · Feb 12, 2017

Of course it's their job and certainly within their capability. You're going to waste a lot of time waiting for the next count. All for a few raw letters.

gotstamps · Feb 12, 2017

<blockquote class="spPostEmbedQuote">Lee Ruby said 
Of course it's their job and certainly within their capability. You're going to waste a lot of time waiting for the next count. All for a few raw letters. </blockquote>
How so? Can't see mgmt going through our DPS to pull out the 'holds' for us. Who pulls the rest of the hold items? Where are these "holds" kept?

We have 60 rural routes between 2 offices+ city routes in both. We don't have enough mgmt to do these pulls daily. I have a hard enough time getting my 'Premium Forward' sent out on time, especially when my sub keeps forgetting it at the CBU. 5 'holds' & this is the one he neglects to bring back on the day before it ships out making the clerks wait for me to retrieve it.

As I said, I've never heard of mgmt pulling our holds & glad for it! During count it's piece counted & adds up quickly. Our holds are kept at our desk in a slotted holder. I make a copy of our 'hold notices' and case it as a reminder for CBUs & use a red 'box marker' for curbs. Easy for the clerk if a P/U & easy for me when time for delivery.