Proper multiple trips procedure for large pick ups.

[Rural-life-0323]

If your daily pickup volumes have exceeded the size your government vehicle can handle (fully loaded) and you have to return to do second or third trips, as a regular, what is the proper procedure under RRECS.

My understanding is you go to PMCasing, go back out, record the total miles and when you get back you record how much time it takes to unload again and that should be 8127 time since it's additional Return2Du time that you aren't getting and can't restart again. I've also read a letter that sounds like when you go back out to your pickup location you go into StartLoad and EndLoad time again.

Management claims the RSS managers says there is no 8127 time or load time, but I've heard otherwise. What is the, by the book, correct process to get paid right?

EDIT: I forget to add that this is on an 48K route, so an increase in the evaluation is not possible.

EDIT 2 FOR FUTURE READERS: The union is currently working on this exact subject right now. There is no current RRECS policy. Using Load and Endload is falsifying records. At the moment we have to finish our end of shift duties. Go onto PMcasing. Go back out and record our full mileage. We will get paid our 3 minutes a mile pay for now, but record and document on the 4240 how much time it takes to unload when you get back for future reference. Again this issue is being worked on right now and there are a few ways that are being looked at as a solution to this.

 

[neciat]

While I am NOT entirely certain on the proper procedure, you might want to argue this from The Nat'l Agreement ;

13. Recurring Work Duties

When daily recurring work duties other than traditional
service functions are added to or removed from a route
after the latest route evaluation, the Employer shall
promptly determine time requirements for such added or
removed duties and authorize any appropriate
adjustment of evaluated compensation.

Now, carrier pickup MIGHT be considered as a traditional service function. Then again, maybe NOT. At any rate, daily or even weekly second and third trips are NOT.

 

[Worve]

Once done with all duties before heading back out pm casing, record miles for second trip pay. Once at location do another pick up rrecs scan or multiple if over 99 parcels. Once back at office start load to unload vehicle and properly place pick ups where they belong. Rinse repeat as many times as you need to. Have a pick up during peak I can pick up 500-3k+ parcels. This is how I always do it personally.

 

[gotstamps]

If your daily pickup volumes have exceeded the size your government vehicle can handle (fully loaded) and you have to return to do second or third trips, as a regular, what is the proper procedure under RRECS.

My understanding is you go to PMCasing, go back out, record the total miles and when you get back you record how much time it takes to unload again and that should be 8127 time since it's additional Return2Du time that you aren't getting and can't restart again. I've also read a letter that sounds like when you go back out to your pickup location you go into StartLoad and EndLoad time again.

Management claims the RSS managers says there is no 8127 time or load time, but I've heard otherwise. What is the, by the book, correct process to get paid right?

EDIT: I forget to add that this is on an 48K route, so an increase in the evaluation is not possible.

Unload is not part of the 2nd trip pay. That can be done under load time to add it into the evaluation.

2nd trip pay is simply 3 minutes per mile plus EMA if applicable.

 

[Rural-life-0323]

That can be done under load time to add it into the evaluation.

Yes, this is what I'm trying to get at. So does the policy say I can use load and end load time to compensate for the loss in Return2DU time? Is that correct?

I was told by someone in the union they thought it was 8127 time but either way works if at some point it's accounted for, otherwise this is a problem that needs to be fixed.

 

[Rural-life-0323]

Once done with all duties before heading back out pm casing, record miles for second trip pay. Once at location do another pick up rrecs scan or multiple if over 99 parcels. Once back at office start load to unload vehicle and properly place pick ups where they belong. Rinse repeat as many times as you need to. Have a pick up during peak I can pick up 500-3k+ parcels. This is how I always do it personally.

So is the policy though? RSS said no but management will always side with cheating us.

 

[Worve]

So is the policy though? RSS said no but management will always side with cheating us.

I want credit for route if it becomes an issue and they choose to discipline. That’s what grievances are for. So I will keep doing it the way I am.

 

[Rural-life-0323]

I want credit for route if it becomes an issue and they choose to discipline. That’s what grievances are for. So I will keep doing it the way I am.

I talked to the union. If you do this you're falsifying records so good luck. Start and end load can not be used like this.

There actually is no policy for RRECS at the moment but it's being worked on. The current procedure is PMcasing and record your mileage for pay. It's also advised that we document how long the new Return2DU time is on the 4240 for future reference.

 

[jsthere723]

Once done with all duties before heading back out pm casing, record miles for second trip pay. Once at location do another pick up rrecs scan or multiple if over 99 parcels. Once back at office start load to unload vehicle and properly place pick ups where they belong. Rinse repeat as many times as you need to. Have a pick up during peak I can pick up 500-3k+ parcels. This is how I always do it personally.

Hmm . Novel thinking . But does RRECS Scan under PMCASING like those pickup scan gets included in the RRECS data ? I am inclined to think it doesn’t. Not sure though . same goes for load/unload . I believe once you are in PMCASING all further RRRECS entry is null and void except the clock out . But as I said it before I am not sure

 

[Worve]

Hmm . Novel thinking . But does RRECS Scan under PMCASING like those pickup scan gets included in the RRECS data ? I am inclined to think it doesn’t. Not sure though . same goes for load/unload . I believe once you are in PMCASING all further RRRECS entry is null and void except the clock out . But as I said it before I am not sure

It should be included in eval, regardless if under pm casing or not. It does show up when you look at rrecs entries at the end of the day as does number of parcels picked up. Same goes for trip to doors etc.

 

[Rural-life-0323]

Hmm . Novel thinking . But does RRECS Scan under PMCASING like those pickup scan gets included in the RRECS data ? I am inclined to think it doesn’t. Not sure though . same goes for load/unload . I believe once you are in PMCASING all further RRRECS entry is null and void except the clock out . But as I said it before I am not sure

The load truck does get recorded because that's what you use when loading you vehicle at the office for a second trip of lets say an express. The other events should be getting recorded too.

However using loadtruck in this manner is falsify records and would be a violation of the RRECS procedures. At the moment there is no process for additional return2du unloading.

 

[neciat]

EDIT: I forget to add that this is on an 48K route, so an increase in the evaluation is not possible

Are the standard hours for the route in excess of 57:36 ?

 

[Rural-life-0323]

Are the standard hours for the route in excess of 57:36 ?

Based on the formula used when I filed a grievance I'm at 70 standard hours and that was well before this large pickup started. Curious what the new 4241 will say. I've been frozen for a year now.

I'm not over 57 hours yet on the actual hours though. I still stay under evaluation most days. They will send me help once in a while when it's a super heavy day but they aren't required to help me yet.

 

[neciat]

Based on the formula used when I filed a grievance I'm at 70 standard hours and that was well before this large pickup started. Curious what the new 4241 will say. I've been frozen for a year now.

I'm not over 57 hours yet on the actual hours though. I still stay under evaluation most days. They will send me help once in a while when it's a super heavy day but they aren't required to help me yet.

Well, according to The Nat'l Agreement , the route you serve is overburdened when ;

8. Overburdened Routes
a. Definition

A route is considered overburdened when:

(1) The standard hours for the route are outside
of the Table of Evaluated Hours;

b. Relief of Overburdened Routes

Permanent relief will be arranged as soon as prac-
ticable for overburdened routes


8.a.(1). Assistance is provided, equivalent to the
lesser of the following:

(1) The regular rural carrier’s actual weekly work
hours that are in excess of 48 hours (K
classification); or
(2) The standard hours for the route that are in
excess of 57:36

Perhaps the relief could handle the extra pickup parcels .

 

[Rural-life-0323]

Perhaps the relief could handle the extra pickup parcels .

Yeah I'm allowed to get help and district can just shove it if they complain, but I'm not at the point where they're required to give me help yet. Once I start going over 48 actual hours in a week they won't have a choice. At this point I'm barely doing over 40 hours. This pay period I should be higher and getting closer to 48 actual hours.

The question I have on that is whether my sub will hurt getting to 57:36 hours since they rush and don't do the entire job that they're required to do.

 

[Worve]

Yeah I'm allowed to get help and district can just shove it if they complain, but I'm not at the point where they're required to give me help yet. Once I start going over 48 actual hours in a week they won't have a choice. At this point I'm barely doing over 40 hours. This pay period I should be higher and getting closer to 48 actual hours.

The question I have on that is whether my sub will hurt getting to 57:36 hours since they rush and don't do the entire job that they're required to do.

Speed has no real bearing on eval, everything we do has time standards. Beyond EoS load and any so called optional rrecs entries input into the scanner daily. Now if they are just loading in a hurry, same for EoS yes that will impact eval. Just as cramming boxes with parcels and not taking them to the door or not putting in proper location delivered to will.

 

[neciat]

Standard hours and evaluation hours are two totally different things. The RCA is entitled to work the evaluation of the route which is 48.

 

[Rural-life-0323]

Speed has no real bearing on eval, everything we do has time standards. Beyond EoS load and any so called optional rrecs entries input into the scanner daily. Now if they are just loading in a hurry, same for EoS yes that will impact eval. Just as cramming boxes with parcels and not taking them to the door or not putting in proper location delivered to will.

I'm talking about the actual hours, not the standard hours. If he's rushing I won't get to 57 actual hours so they are forced to send me help is my concern but it seems like it's when I hit 48 hours if I'm reading your post correctly.