Route cutting is ridiculous and stupid

[damifiknow]

shannon boy, buckle up . because you ar about to get some more of it.

 

[FrozenToes]

They could actually figure out a volume factor for each address, based on informed delivery and packages. What I think is crazy is that they rob us with coverage percentage, but coverage percentage isn't a factor in cutting. The average central box coverage percentage in my office is 60%. So we're only getting paid for 60% of our central boxes. If you where an aux route that let's day gained 100 boxes to become a regular j route, 52 weeks later you'd drop because the cov % isn't 100 boxes.
I'm pretty sure no-one has 100% cov factor. So if you lost 100 central boxes to make you a 43k did you really just loose 60?
I guess we'll find out.

Coverage factor is used in adjustments. Look at the worksheet. It is used to calculate Adjusted Box Service Time.

 

[Haygrrl]

There lies my issue.

In my case, I can tell you 100% without a doubt which route will get screwed next count after a year. They are saying these are 3 hours both.

52 boxes losing 1 mile with like 40 stops
81 boxes losing 6 miles with like 71 stops

81 has more volume.

They should be able to get very close estimate on section of routes that are set time frames, but instead we just make up a bunch of and call it good.

Others and I don't have issues with the route cut itself, but the issue is somehow "both of these are 3hours."

Drive speed matrix have any bearing on this comparison?

 

[ATCBigE]

Drive speed matrix have any bearing on this comparison?

It shouldn't have because they were suppose to lose similar things (both subdivisions) so speed would have to be some what similar.

 

[Voglio-il mio]

They could actually figure out a volume factor for each address, based on informed delivery and packages. What I think is crazy is that they rob us with coverage percentage, but coverage percentage isn't a factor in cutting. The average central box coverage percentage in my office is 60%. So we're only getting paid for 60% of our central boxes. If you where an aux route that let's day gained 100 boxes to become a regular j route, 52 weeks later you'd drop because the cov % isn't 100 boxes.
I'm pretty sure no-one has 100% cov factor. So if you lost 100 central boxes to make you a 43k did you really just loose 60?
I guess we'll find out.

What really get my goat is that we get so little credit for DPS and then they hit us again with just a percentage of that.

 

[Gyros6875]

Well route cuts went into effect in my office and it is an interesting experience.

They cut 3 of us down to 43k, made the aux a K route and created another tiny 2hr aux route. We tried to just leave my route alone as a 47k and make 3 44K routes but district wouldn't have it.

Big issue is that our 2hr aux is a POV route and no RCAs have a POV. And none of them will buy one for that route. They also refuse to run it since it keeps them from running a full route for the day. (who wants to come into work and get paid only 2hrs)

Ironically I am now getting more money after the route cuts. I have been finishing my route around noon and running the Aux after.

 

[jsthere723]

Well route cuts went into effect in my office and it is an interesting experience.

They cut 3 of us down to 43k, made the aux a K route and created another tiny 2hr aux route. We tried to just leave my route alone as a 47k and make 3 44K routes but district wouldn't have it.

Big issue is that our 2hr aux is a POV route and no RCAs have a POV. And none of them will buy one for that route. They also refuse to run it since it keeps them from running a full route for the day. (who wants to come into work and get paid only 2hrs)

Ironically I am now getting more money after the route cuts. I have been finishing my route around noon and running the Aux after.

It’s not ironical . Many of us are pointing that out that this is gonna happen . While they will save money on TSP matching and retirement money , but carrier’s take home money will go up now if PO make carrier do the same extra work due to lack of personnel. It is not a perfect solution but it surely will pay the worker little more than they were getting paid for same work

 

[LEFTINGUTTER]

I knew this is / was / would be occurring once that MOU was agreed upon where the evaluation(s) are "frozen" for one year. So, of course they are going to cut a 48K to a 43K and "freeze" that 43K pay while they have added BACK the equivalent or more work. With this thread and all of the others regarding route "adjustments" on here, all of a sudden the PO is all gung ho regarding cutting routes. Why do you think that is ?

ALWAYS REMEMBER YOU DO NOT GET WHAT YOU DO NOT PAY FOR
So freeze the pay and that is all the work you will get corners will be cut to avoid working for free.
idiots make idiotic decissions that only cost the post office more money and angry customers.

 

[Haygrrl]

Talking to friend of mine, and they are in office with 2 overburdened routes with hers being one of them.

They have an aux route 2 48K and 44K. So obviously 44K nothing is happening with it. 1 48k is all 1 zip. Other 48K is 2 zip small town & main office zip

So the idea of cutting the 2 routes was the following:

1 zip 48K would cut 60-65 boxes off end of route near the Aux route and be given to aux route. MAKES SENSE???? Right.

2 zip route (only cutting from main zip), they are about 70 boxes heavy package area & giving it to the 1 zip 48K

WHAT WORLD DOES THAT MAKE ANY !#@#ING SENSE?!?!!? I mean you have overburden route and taking from it and just adding back on to it with about same amount of boxes but more packages and miles?????

1000%
We're scheduled to be adjusted the end of June. 10 weeks later ( i think) we have an mms...REALLY???!..totally assanine

 

[Deleted member 7264]

Route cuts went into effect in our office today. They had to create 2 auxiliary POV routes that we don't have any RCAs for, or anybody with a POV for that matter. Our postmaster came in and was scrambling to case up one of the new aux routes because theres nobody to do it. Our newspapers and presort flats still came sorted according to the old routes so wasted a bunch of time walking stuff over. Same with packages. All us 47-48k routes got done by 1-2pm so nobody wanted these cuts. Funny how they could've just avoided all this headache by leaving the routes alone, instead of trying to fix what's not broken. These route adjustments probably cost the post office money because now they have to pay out more DACA 5 with our subs spread thin on the auxiliary routes now. I bet by the time our papers come in the right order it will be time for them to rearrange the routes again when one of our 46ks goes up to a 47k+ at the next survey. Anyway just think the whole thing is ridiculous. They ought to change the definition of what is considered overburdened and set 45-46k as the target evaluation instead of 43k.

 

[neciat]

Route cuts went into effect in our office today. They had to create 2 auxiliary POV routes that we don't have any RCAs for, or anybody with a POV for that matter. Our postmaster came in and was scrambling to case up one of the new aux routes because theres nobody to do it. Our newspapers and presort flats still came sorted according to the old routes so wasted a bunch of time walking stuff over. Same with packages. All us 47-48k routes got done by 1-2pm so nobody wanted these cuts. Funny how they could've just avoided all this headache by leaving the routes alone, instead of trying to fix what's not broken. These route adjustments probably cost the post office money because now they have to pay out more DACA 5 with our subs spread thin on the auxiliary routes now. I bet by the time our papers come in the right order it will be time for them to rearrange the routes again when one of our 46ks goes up to a 47k+ at the next survey. Anyway just think the whole thing is ridiculous. They ought to change the definition of what is considered overburdened and set 45-46k as the target evaluation instead of 43k.

Some of what you have stated would / could be in your carrier input ;

I request that financial harm be kept to a minimum by the adjustment as I have
demonstrated the ability to keep my actual work hours at or below the 2080 hour
threshold for the previous Guarantee Period(s). Additionally, if said route is being
adjusted due to being contractually overburdened, having maintained my actual work
hours at or below the 2080 hour threshold for the previous Guarantee Period(s) not
only justifies but also substantiates my request to keep financial harm to a minimum
and , therefore, adjusting said route to the recommended but not required 52 standard
hours would not be necessary. ( Ref . M-38 Section 823.13 )

I request that all information be sent to operations for approval ; all route
maps, line of travel , and edit book information be in place 4 to 6 weeks in
advance of the implementation date to provide mailers sufficient time to
update their mailing lists both nationally and locally.

I request that the clerks in this facility be properly scheme trained
and perform the breakdown of carrier route directs if the mailers have not
substantially corrected their mailings.
I request that all information relevant and pertinent in this adjustment be made
available to include a map showing the delivery territory of all routes in this
Post Office ; PS Form 4012, and the individual route adjustment
sheets , Form(s) 500.
I respectfully request a response to the specific recommendations I have
submitted with this document.

There's more regarding edit books, casing equipment, labels, etc. but you get the idea. Now, the loyalists will roll their eyes with all of this and management won't like it either. That let's you know they're on the same side. Anyway, while adjustments WILL occur, we need to make certain that adjustments are performed efficiently, properly, and entail much more than just sitting behind a desk and "moving stuff" .

 

[Gyros6875]

Route cuts went into effect in our office today. They had to create 2 auxiliary POV routes that we don't have any RCAs for, or anybody with a POV for that matter. Our postmaster came in and was scrambling to case up one of the new aux routes because theres nobody to do it. Our newspapers and presort flats still came sorted according to the old routes so wasted a bunch of time walking stuff over. Same with packages. All us 47-48k routes got done by 1-2pm so nobody wanted these cuts. Funny how they could've just avoided all this headache by leaving the routes alone, instead of trying to fix what's not broken. These route adjustments probably cost the post office money because now they have to pay out more DACA 5 with our subs spread thin on the auxiliary routes now. I bet by the time our papers come in the right order it will be time for them to rearrange the routes again when one of our 46ks goes up to a 47k+ at the next survey. Anyway just think the whole thing is ridiculous. They ought to change the definition of what is considered overburdened and set 45-46k as the target evaluation instead of 43k.

They really should not have route cuts if the carrier on the route is ok with with it being a 47/48k, they are not in 2080/2240 trouble and it wouldn't prevent another route from going full time. Both my Postmaster and his boss (POOM I think) were fine leaving my route a 47K but the route cut person at district said we had to cut it.

My office now has a 2hr POV Aux route. Our entire office besides that has GOV vehicles so no RCA has a POV to run it. And no one is going to buy a POV for a 2hr Aux route. Or even wants to come in for only 2hrs of pay.

But I get done at noon now so that's fun I guess. I am going to be well under 30hrs working 6 days a week.

 

[IDPOSTAL]

They really should not have route cuts if the carrier on the route is ok with with it being a 47/48k, they are not in 2080/2240 trouble and it wouldn't prevent another route from going full time. Both my Postmaster and his boss (POOM I think) were fine leaving my route a 47K but the route cut person at district said we had to cut it.

My office now has a 2hr POV Aux route. Our entire office besides that has GOV vehicles so no RCA has a POV to run it. And no one is going to buy a POV for a 2hr Aux route. Or even wants to come in for only 2hrs of pay.

But I get done at noon now so that's fun I guess. I am going to be well under 30hrs working 6 days a week.

You can always volunteer to do the AUX when you are done with your rt.--OT for all hours worked. CHA
CHING!!

 

[Aviate]

Some of what you have stated would / could be in your carrier input ;

I request that financial harm be kept to a minimum by the adjustment as I have
demonstrated the ability to keep my actual work hours at or below the 2080 hour
threshold for the previous Guarantee Period(s). Additionally, if said route is being
adjusted due to being contractually overburdened, having maintained my actual work
hours at or below the 2080 hour threshold for the previous Guarantee Period(s) not
only justifies but also substantiates my request to keep financial harm to a minimum
and , therefore, adjusting said route to the recommended but not required 52 standard
hours would not be necessary. ( Ref . M-38 Section 823.13 )

I request that all information be sent to operations for approval ; all route
maps, line of travel , and edit book information be in place 4 to 6 weeks in
advance of the implementation date to provide mailers sufficient time to
update their mailing lists both nationally and locally.

I request that the clerks in this facility be properly scheme trained
and perform the breakdown of carrier route directs if the mailers have not
substantially corrected their mailings.
I request that all information relevant and pertinent in this adjustment be made
available to include a map showing the delivery territory of all routes in this
Post Office ; PS Form 4012, and the individual route adjustment
sheets , Form(s) 500.
I respectfully request a response to the specific recommendations I have
submitted with this document.

There's more regarding edit books, casing equipment, labels, etc. but you get the idea. Now, the loyalists will roll their eyes with all of this and management won't like it either. That let's you know they're on the same side. Anyway, while adjustments WILL occur, we need to make certain that adjustments are performed efficiently, properly, and entail much more than just sitting behind a desk and "moving stuff" .

I did all of this, myself. Told them I'm nowhere near 2080 time (I'm the fastest carrier in my office) and that mail and package volume has plummeted and to just let my route drop naturally. I'm a 47k that was finishing their route by 12pm every day but Monday, since late February. They ignored everything about it. Management still has not told me what my new evaluation would be after they cut literally half of my route from me and did a territory swap with another route that was already a 43k. They only gave me my new labels and said "I don't know what your eval will be, I guess 43k." FOR CLARITY - They told me at the start of April that my "route is on the list to be cut" and "we'll be in touch," but i never heard another word from them. These cuts went into effect yesterday 05/31. I have been given absolutely ZERO documentation on what they've done to my route beyond having new labels given to me. Our 4240s are still exactly the same as before as well. They are telling the carrier that they put my cut portions on that his route isn't going up in minutes whatsoever, when that simply is not possible. He's gaining nearly 100 boxes and they're saying that won't change his route?! They cut 200 boxes from mine and gave me a CBU with 50 boxes.

I spoke with a local area union president and he said "the union is NOT pushing for these cuts on 47Ks, they only had an MOU to target routes over 48K. So postal Management is lying to carriers by saying 'the union is pushing for this' in an attempt to focus blame on someone besides themselves." Hell, the supervisor that input the data for the side of the office (zip code) that I'm on hasn't even been in the office for more than the last 2 weeks and has been gone since before April before that.

The PO is very obviously using this to get free work out of carriers and blaming the MOU. Our OIC is even saying "your pay won't change until after October" with these cuts, which makes no sense. How are you gonna put a route as 43k but think payroll is going to keep paying me 47K money? That's not how that works, and then on top of it, when it does turn out we'll be getting paid as 43K, the Post Office will then have stolen our wages because RRECS pays you for the work you DID, not what you're currently doing.

The union needs to step it up and put a stop to this. Thinking Management hasn't figured out a way to abuse this system, especially with the "lock in" period, is completely ignorant.

I'll also mention how they felt the need to cut me and another carrier from 47 to 43, but did a territory swap between two other routes not involved with our routes, and bumped one carrier up to a 45k, whilst saying "the union wants all routes not above 52 hours." How is that not straight up disparagment?! If you can bump another route to 45k and be telling them they'll be locked to a 45k thanks to that bump, then you had zero need in cutting a 47k to a 43!

 

[Shannonboy]

I hate to say it......but I did say it MULTIPLE TIMES.....rrec's was going to be the tool they used to rob us, and they are still robbing us, and they will continue to ROB us while thinking up other ways to rob us. DANGIT....the one time you want to be wrong. I hate being right on this...

 

[Rt2mailman]

I did all of this, myself. Told them I'm nowhere near 2080 time (I'm the fastest carrier in my office) and that mail and package volume has plummeted and to just let my route drop naturally. I'm a 47k that was finishing their route by 12pm every day but Monday, since late February. They ignored everything about it. Management still has not told me what my new evaluation would be after they cut literally half of my route from me and did a territory swap with another route that was already a 43k. They only gave me my new labels and said "I don't know what your eval will be, I guess 43k." FOR CLARITY - They told me at the start of April that my "route is on the list to be cut" and "we'll be in touch," but i never heard another word from them. These cuts went into effect yesterday 05/31. I have been given absolutely ZERO documentation on what they've done to my route beyond having new labels given to me. Our 4240s are still exactly the same as before as well. They are telling the carrier that they put my cut portions on that his route isn't going up in minutes whatsoever, when that simply is not possible. He's gaining nearly 100 boxes and they're saying that won't change his route?! They cut 200 boxes from mine and gave me a CBU with 50 boxes.

I spoke with a local area union president and he said "the union is NOT pushing for these cuts on 47Ks, they only had an MOU to target routes over 48K. So postal Management is lying to carriers by saying 'the union is pushing for this' in an attempt to focus blame on someone besides themselves." Hell, the supervisor that input the data for the side of the office (zip code) that I'm on hasn't even been in the office for more than the last 2 weeks and has been gone since before April before that.

The PO is very obviously using this to get free work out of carriers and blaming the MOU. Our OIC is even saying "your pay won't change until after October" with these cuts, which makes no sense. How are you gonna put a route as 43k but think payroll is going to keep paying me 47K money? That's not how that works, and then on top of it, when it does turn out we'll be getting paid as 43K, the Post Office will then have stolen our wages because RRECS pays you for the work you DID, not what you're currently doing.

The union needs to step it up and put a stop to this. Thinking Management hasn't figured out a way to abuse this system, especially with the "lock in" period, is completely ignorant.

I'll also mention how they felt the need to cut me and another carrier from 47 to 43, but did a territory swap between two other routes not involved with our routes, and bumped one carrier up to a 45k, whilst saying "the union wants all routes not above 52 hours." How is that not straight up disparagment?! If you can bump another route to 45k and be telling them they'll be locked to a 45k thanks to that bump, then you had zero need in cutting a 47k to a 43!

Unless your manager can provide a valid explanation (usually due to "squaring up" routes)of why one route can be made larger than another, you should file a grievance because you are being treated in a disparate manner. If there was enough volume to build the other route up two hours, then there was enough to make each route a 44.

 

[neciat]

I hate to say it......but I did say it MULTIPLE TIMES.....rrec's was going to be the tool they used to rob us, and they are still robbing us, and they will continue to ROB us while thinking up other ways to rob us. DANGIT....the one time you want to be wrong. I hate being right on this...

When we enter multiple trips at an authorized dismount , sell stamps , two boxholders in one day, etc. ,these actions are generally looked upon as cheating and stealing. When we are the recipients of loss, it is "accounting" or "adjustments" .

 

[Shannonboy]

When we enter multiple trips at an authorized dismount , sell stamps , two boxholders in one day, etc. ,these actions are generally looked upon as cheating and stealing. When we are the recipients of loss, it is "accounting" or "adjustments" .

Nice comment Neciat. It's very simple to see that if we as carriers, pulled tricks, or as Neciat said ADJUSTMENTS to pad our rts, and our pay, we would all be setting in federal penitentiaries waiting for our sentences to run out for ROBBING the federal govt. but when they do it....well...
NO BIG DEAL....unless you are the one getting robbed. I've come to realize that some fights are impossible to win, and some aren't.....but you have to be realistic, and decide if its "THE HILL" to die on. If its important to you....go for it.....if its gonna cost you your sanity, your family, your life, your job, and you are counting on our crap union to come through for you, and po mgmt to mysteriously decide to do the right thing for once.....my advice...DONT.
Pick the ones you can mostly win, and cut the CRAP situations loose, and enjoy your life.....it is worth it.
Shannonboy

 

[Aviate]

Unless your manager can provide a valid explanation (usually due to "squaring up" routes)of why one route can be made larger than another, you should file a grievance because you are being treated in a disparate manner. If there was enough volume to build the other route up two hours, then there was enough to make each route a 44.

I've filed probably 10 grievances over the last 4 days because of all of this. I haven't even been a K route for a year now, i just had a business that swamped my route with packages and pick ups from July '24 to January '25 and that business is gone now, so my volume absolutely plummeted.

Management has given me absolutely ZERO documentation or anything beyond my new labels for this cut. They haven't even given me a definitive response to what my route will be beyond telling the carrier that was getting my cut part that my route would be made a 43K.

Our District Rep that my local rep spoke with has basically said we're just out of luck with it all. I've contacted John Adams and he's gotten slightly involved with my local rep but I don't know to what degree exactly. I just don't have any faith in the union doing right by me right now, they really never have. I hate it. Every day I'm full of f###ing rage because of all of this. I cannot afford to live on my own in my area with my current salary, let alone taking yet another $8000 pay cut when everything is still getting more and more expensive, and I'm completely debt free no less. My kids and I had to move back in with my parents back before RRECS and it's like an ever crushing cycle at this point. I'm turning 37 at the end of the month and feel like I'm still working a part time job at a fast food restaurant but with more hours and stress and no pay to show for it.

 

[Shannonboy]

I've filed probably 10 grievances over the last 4 days because of all of this. I haven't even been a K route for a year now, i just had a business that swamped my route with packages and pick ups from July '24 to January '25 and that business is gone now, so my volume absolutely plummeted.

Management has given me absolutely ZERO documentation or anything beyond my new labels for this cut. They haven't even given me a definitive response to what my route will be beyond telling the carrier that was getting my cut part that my route would be made a 43K.

Our District Rep that my local rep spoke with has basically said we're just out of luck with it all. I've contacted John Adams and he's gotten slightly involved with my local rep but I don't know to what degree exactly. I just don't have any faith in the union doing right by me right now, they really never have. I hate it. Every day I'm full of f###ing rage because of all of this. I cannot afford to live on my own in my area with my current salary, let alone taking yet another $8000 pay cut when everything is still getting more and more expensive, and I'm completely debt free no less. My kids and I had to move back in with my parents back before RRECS and it's like an ever crushing cycle at this point. I'm turning 37 at the end of the month and feel like I'm still working a part time job at a fast food restaurant but with more hours and stress and no pay to show for it.

Aviate....you are not alone....and I know that's probably not a huge beacon of Hope when you are smack dab in the middle of this traumatic emotional drowning/financial raping that you are experiencing, and all your loved ones are depending on you.
Sssiiiigggghhhhh....I have been there my friend, and so have many people on this site. A couple things I'd like to address with you....First, you cant dwell on the train wreck of the post office, and their IDIOT MGMT.....when you finish work, take a few minutes to leave all that stress behind you, if you can. DO NOT TAKE IT HOME WITH YOU. Look at EAP, its paid for on the po's dime. 6 free counseling sessions, tell them where you are at, get it out, youd be surprised at how
de-stressing it is to be able to tell a stranger how much you hate your po mgmt....lol!! I speak from experience.....also make plans for side incomes like cleaning friends/family's homes, or whatever, a couple times a month. Set that money aside as much as possible for a rainy day, or emergency.
Start to acknowledge to yourself that some fights are winnable, some arent. Dont waste time fighting when there is no winnable solution, or where you ultimately win, but lose in the long run....
Lastly remember who you are as a person. This job does not DEFINE us, we are deserving of a honest days work for an honest days pay. We deserve RESPECT, CONSIDERATION, APPRECIATION, AND RECOGNITION FOR WHAT WE DO EACH AND EVERY DAY. DONT LET PO MGMT TAKE AWAY YOUR DIGNITY, OR HUMANITY. Aviate....dont forget who you are....and know that any company with a single brain cell that works would be delighted to have a HARDWORKING AMERICAN like yourself....because its TRUE...
Shannonboy