Are we getting paid?

[FrozenToes]

When it comes to the postal service, demonstrated ability is what you will be judged on.

The days of skating through your route and going home are. over.

If you have demonstrated that you can run a 9 hour route in 6, then guess what? That's what you will be expected to do. If you then decide, because you figure out that you are losing money by not following all delivery standards to the T, to do it by the book, you will be under the microscope.

Those of us who figured out a long time ago where this debacle was going to lead won't (or at least not as hard).

Just sayin'.

I don't understand why you would think this. RRECs has assigned times for most tasks. The only variable is loading.(?)
You could hurt yourself by not taking parcels or extra trips to door. Not doing the extra RRECs scans. Skipping delivery to boxes.
But I see no instance where demonstrated ability would be used. Unless to harass you or RRECs is replaced.
Meanwhile, I will do my job safely, by the book and efficiently. I will enjoy my extra time away from work while you're demonstrating your ability.

 

[Skierstmoritz]

I don't understand why you would think this. RRECs has assigned times for most tasks. The only variable is loading.(?)
You could hurt yourself by not taking parcels or extra trips to door. Not doing the extra RRECs scans. Skipping delivery to boxes.
But I see no instance where demonstrated ability would be used. Unless to harass you or RRECs is replaced.
Meanwhile, I will do my job safely, by the book and efficiently. I will enjoy my extra time away from work while you're demonstrating your ability.

Imho, counts as we knew them are ancient history. While we are in limbo waiting for rrecs to be implemented the machine, thru the scanner and other data collection devices, is quietly accumulating the history of your route running in relation to the amount of product( mail, pkgs, etc) u deliver. Machine probably has more than a years worth of the data already. What are u gonna say when they tell you, well, for the last 2 years it takes you , on average, 6 1/2 hrs to do your route. That's what we are going to pay you! How can u argue with that. Anyway, that's just my opinion, but a lot of what ups does is based on that. I think that will happen and I agree with oi veh. Meanwhile, Enjoy that xtra time away from work. It's not going to last.

 

[Sandygirl]

Imho, counts as we knew them are ancient history. While we are in limbo waiting for rrecs to be implemented the machine, thru the scanner and other data collection devices, is quietly accumulating the history of your route running in relation to the amount of product( mail, pkgs, etc) u deliver. Machine probably has more than a years worth of the data already. What are u gonna say when they tell you, well, for the last 2 years it takes you , on average, 6 1/2 hrs to do your route. That's what we are going to pay you! How can u argue with that. Anyway, that's just my opinion, but a lot of what ups does is based on that. I think that will happen and I agree with oi veh. Meanwhile, Enjoy that xtra time away from work. It's not going to last.

Already seen some of this, ole time carrier $36 an hour finished in bout 5 hours on 8 hr or more eval.....she did not take the LAST count and ride along with PM seriously and did not up date Edit books or such because always just joked and got by as years and years she has, then the hammer fell and she lost several hundred a month BITCHED and BITCHED,,, then that passed and she was told over a year ago by many who are in UNION she is not to take scanner to door , slow down and prove your evaluated hours are correct for future pay.... today she passed me up headed back to the PO at 11:15 AM I completed mine at 3:30...… she will BITCH again when the hammer falls again but it is deserved..... she once said why do I have to join the union when yall tell us everything anyway???? That info stopped a year ago...

 

[Sandygirl]

Imho, counts as we knew them are ancient history. While we are in limbo waiting for rrecs to be implemented the machine, thru the scanner and other data collection devices, is quietly accumulating the history of your route running in relation to the amount of product( mail, pkgs, etc) u deliver. Machine probably has more than a years worth of the data already. What are u gonna say when they tell you, well, for the last 2 years it takes you , on average, 6 1/2 hrs to do your route. That's what we are going to pay you! How can u argue with that. Anyway, that's just my opinion, but a lot of what ups does is based on that. I think that will happen and I agree with oi veh. Meanwhile, Enjoy that xtra time away from work. It's not going to last.

Recently Pm pointed out running a little late today...… Yep like my evaluated time and intend to keep it!!!!

 

[Oi veh.]

@Jmdw52 and @FrozenToes - I am basing my assumptions on what I have been told by people not only in in study offices, but also people in union positions.

Part of our eval is going to based on info gathered by the scanner. So, for example, if you are scanning at the vehicle you are going to cut yourself out of extra time on package delivery. That is part of demonstrated ability. It takes me 5 minutes to deliver, it takes you 1 minute. I will get paid the 5.

I am not stupid and I do understand, as much as any of us can, how RRECS will work. What I think many don't understand is that if you are not doing things by the book, your wallet is going to suffer.

I guess that we will all have to see how it all shakes out and if I am proven wrong, I am a big enough person to admit it.

 

[FrozenToes]

@Jmdw52 and @FrozenToes - I am basing my assumptions on what I have been told by people not only in in study offices, but also people in union positions.

Part of our eval is going to based on info gathered by the scanner. So, for example, if you are scanning at the vehicle you are going to cut yourself out of extra time on package delivery. That is part of demonstrated ability. It takes me 5 minutes to deliver, it takes you 1 minute. I will get paid the 5.

I am not stupid and I do understand, as much as any of us can, how RRECS will work. What I think many don't understand is that if you are not doing things by the book, your wallet is going to suffer.

I guess that we will all have to see how it all shakes out and if I am proven wrong, I am a big enough person to admit it.

In my post above I mentioned how carriers can hurt themselves by not following the correct procedures.
In your example RRECs has times for every step: Driving speed to stop, walking speed, deliver parcels to door, prelim and concluding at vehicle for trip to door, and gather large parcel fixed + variable.
All fixed times.
Doesn't matter how long it takes you as long as you do all of the steps.

 

[DB.Cooper]

In my post above I mentioned how carriers can hurt themselves by not following the correct procedures.
In your example RRECs has times for every step: Driving speed to stop, walking speed, deliver parcels to door, prelim and concluding at vehicle for trip to door, and gather large parcel fixed + variable.
All fixed times.
Doesn't matter how long it takes you as long as you do all of the steps.

I'm not holding my breath, but wouldn't it be just wonderful if the NRLCA would share some of the info from the ~4205 route "test"... how did those routes come out... old eval -vs- new eval under RRECS... did they gain, lose, stay the same??? What are the differences... some hard data would sure beat all of this speculation we are now forced to do because of the typical lack of information provided... just sayin'....

 

[mwellis32]

SO how will a new slow employee get paid? By the average evaluation or current RRECS data?? So will a fast worker get paid the regulars average time or vise versa? Or will we know we are getting screwed all the time anyway? If you can do 10 hours worth of work in 6 and 1/2 your screwed and if you have to do 5 hours of work in 8 or 9 your screwed. What a system and cluster F.

 

[Jmdw52]

Part of our eval is going to based on info gathered by the scanner. So, for example, if you are scanning at the vehicle you are going to cut yourself out of extra time on package delivery. That is part of demonstrated ability. It takes me 5 minutes to deliver, it takes you 1 minute. I will get paid the 5.

Wouldn’t a case like this make more sense?

Package goes 100 feet to door... you take 5 min, I take 1, but the average carrier takes 3.... so we both get paid 3?

I find it odd that they don’t require us to tell them if we are taking dps to road or not.... if they don’t account for that difference... well almost anyone casing will get hit pretty hard...

My main point though was that if they do manage to shake up routes as hard as you seem to suggest... it’s likely many will be just as unhappy with the new system... hell, in my own office... we’d probably see route consolidation pretty quickly.

 

[mwellis32]

Managers do not deliver mail, so how do they know how to pay us to deliver mail? Managers can not manage! Managers can not deliver! You want rurals to deliver like city carriers without the time clock, based on a screwed up time standard measuring system. I hate to say it, but a time clock is the only remedy to this circus.

 

[Oi veh.]

Union has been saying all along that there will be winners and losers in the new system...just like the old. Some will be happy, some will be sad.

All i know is this: It's easier to speed up than to slow down. I work the same pace every day and have been setting my "observed" times. It is what it is. I'm not going to sweat it. 7 years to go.

 

[Deer Smearer]

Union has been saying all along that there will be winners and losers in the new system...just like the old. Some will be happy, some will be sad.

All i know is this: It's easier to speed up than to slow down. I work the same pace every day and have been setting my "observed" times. It is what it is. I'm not going to sweat it. 7 years to go.

Load time will be actual time. Express detours will be actual time. PM work (or should I say afternoon because we know postmasters don't work) will be actual time.

Don't think manglement won't try to lower standards and fingered mail that gets stuffed in boxes without stopping will be targeted as excessive.

Those actual time tasks will be under the microscope daily.

 

[Rcflyn]

I was discussing the scanning items in truck vs drop off site one day with another in office carrier...

One of my concerns was...
These scanners suck at scanning in bright light, so I find it easier to start the scan process in the back of my truck, where it’s nice and dark, click on all options needed, until I get to the zip code screen, then I walk the item to the safest drop spot, then click scanner so it does it’s confirmation beeps.

He seems to think all scans need to be started where you place the item..... but when it’s a bright sunny day, it’s difficult to find shady enough area, and it takes longer to scan out there.....

I think (THINK), wouldn’t it be the final confirmation beep that finalizes the scanned items placement???

If there’s more than one item I can carry, I’ll scan all items I can carry at once at truck, then click to get the beeps where I left them. When I can’t carry all items in 1 trip, I scan what I can carry, click when I place them, then do it again how ever many times I walk back and forth....

What’s y’alls thoughts on this? Start scan at truck where you can get item scanned easily, or start scan where items being placed, and possibly spend 30-60 seconds trying to get these stupid scanners to read on a bright day?????

 

[FrozenToes]

What’s y’alls thoughts on this? Start scan at truck where you can get item scanned easily, or start scan where items being placed, and possibly spend 30-60 seconds trying to get these stupid scanners to read on a bright day?????

My understanding is the scan sets the location. Scan at delivery point.
As far as the sun, tilt package or cup hand along barcode after setting package down.

 

[stillfirstclass]

I know you guys are speaking of the here and now.... the thing I wanted to point out is that the data has been there.... they know what we do, how long it takes, etc.... how old is the post office? 1792? Ok.... so after 227 years we need more accuracy?

It takes a team of engineers to develop a system (RRECS) that isn’t even operational after four years, yet all the years of mail counts, the thousands of employees (demonstrating ability), timesheet data, gps data, data from city side deliveries... all this isn’t enough?

It doesn’t take an engineer to do simple arithmetic.... that’s all an honest count is.

Honesty is what it comes down to... it’s simply unimaginable to think that there aren’t any PO beancounters who know exactly what we are doing... they did have like 200+ years to figure it out.

Management can’t do honest... if they did... it’d be their jobs on the line to save money... not ours.... we do the work here...

could be????? what the po hates the mostt of wrecks: they cannot hide stuff for a mail count 2 weeks long?

 

[stillfirstclass]

I don't expect many will bail. If that were the case all of the carriers working untold amounts of hours over their evals would have already bailed. What I don't understand is why the new system would be considered unfair if a carrier is being paid close to their actual time worked? I wouldn't like if I was beating my eval by hours each week and after RRECS I worked really close to eval but how is that unfair? Remember that the new system will still be an incentive system with 80-90% of carriers being able to meet or beat their evals. (At least that is what we have been told) It seems like the one forgotten thing in all of this are the carriers working way more than they are being paid. We will get the right times for the things we do with RRECS and have annual amounts of mail that can't be manipulated like in the past. How is this unfair?

to me, evaluation was more about being left alone, getting along with pm, doing what i had/could to do the best job possible,, being older now, and packages, beating evaluation is nice, but not being exhausted is too......

 

[kindheart]

With RRECS..... routes evaluation will be configured by the combination what leave replacements and regular carriers DO on a specific route. A team mentality is needed! The route is the PO's and will be figured with what information is collected from any party that runs the route.

 

[Deer Smearer]

With RRECS..... routes evaluation will be configured by the combination what leave replacements and regular carriers DO on a specific route. A team mentality is needed! The route is the PO's and will be figured with what information is collected from any party that runs the route.

Yeah, unless the route is split on a heavy day after a holiday. Then that confusion will be too difficult to count.

 

[RDruckus]

I was discussing the scanning items in truck vs drop off site one day with another in office carrier...

One of my concerns was...
These scanners suck at scanning in bright light, so I find it easier to start the scan process in the back of my truck, where it’s nice and dark, click on all options needed, until I get to the zip code screen, then I walk the item to the safest drop spot, then click scanner so it does it’s confirmation beeps.

He seems to think all scans need to be started where you place the item..... but when it’s a bright sunny day.........What’s y’alls thoughts on this? Start scan at truck where you can get item scanned easily, or start scan where items being placed, and possibly spend 30-60 seconds trying to get these stupid scanners to read on a bright day?????

Hit scan at the door in bright light. Go back to ride, complete scan in the shade.
Exception: If customer comes to door and there are more parcels, can scan them at back of truck #3, delivered to customer. ( It counts the same as scanning at the door.)

 

[Rt2mailman]

Rcflyn, as stated above, scan at delivery point. I tested this with a manager, scanned a parcel and drove 5 miles away to deliver and finalize the rest of the scanner steps. It showed I delivered it where the initial scan was made. This is done so if you mis-delivered a parcel (scan shows a certain # of feet away) your pm gets an email saying parcel was "mis-delivered". Management usual answers was at door, but the "bread crumbs" will show where you scanned it.